IRC log of badtf on 2009-03-04

Timestamps are in UTC.

15:54:32 [RRSAgent]
RRSAgent has joined #badtf
15:54:32 [RRSAgent]
logging to http://www.w3.org/2009/03/04-badtf-irc
15:54:42 [shadi]
meeting: BAD TF
15:54:47 [shadi]
agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-wai-eo-badtf/2009Mar/0002.html
15:54:51 [shadi]
chair: Shadi
15:54:59 [shadi]
agenda?
15:56:17 [Tom]
Tom has joined #badtf
15:56:59 [Zakim]
WAI_EOWG(BAD TF)11:00AM has now started
15:57:06 [Zakim]
+Tom
15:57:08 [Zakim]
+Wilco
15:57:10 [Zakim]
-Tom
15:57:12 [Zakim]
+Tom
15:57:18 [Zakim]
-Wilco
15:57:39 [eric]
eric has joined #badtf
15:57:43 [shadi]
zakim, call shadi-617
15:57:43 [Zakim]
ok, shadi; the call is being made
15:57:44 [Zakim]
+Shadi
15:57:59 [shadi]
zakim, who is on the phone?
15:57:59 [Zakim]
On the phone I see Tom, Shadi
15:58:39 [shadi]
zakim, you are confused little bot! :)
15:58:39 [Zakim]
I'm glad that smiley is there, shadi
15:58:47 [Zakim]
+Eric
15:59:16 [Zakim]
+Wilco
16:01:25 [maik_w]
maik_w has joined #badtf
16:02:03 [mbertoni]
mbertoni has joined #badtf
16:03:25 [Zakim]
+Maik
16:04:12 [shadi]
zakim, pick a victim
16:04:12 [Zakim]
Not knowing who is chairing or who scribed recently, I propose Shadi
16:04:30 [shadi]
zakim, pick a victim
16:04:30 [Zakim]
Not knowing who is chairing or who scribed recently, I propose Wilco
16:05:02 [shadi]
scribe: Wilco
16:05:07 [shadi]
agenda?
16:05:14 [Michael]
Michael has joined #badtf
16:05:24 [shadi]
zakim, take up agendum 1
16:05:24 [Zakim]
agendum 1. "In-Between pages" taken up [from shadi]
16:05:34 [shadi]
http://fiers.name/badtf/inbetween_after.html
16:05:51 [shadi]
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-wai-eo-badtf/2009Mar/0000
16:06:26 [Wilco]
wilco: I'd like some feedback
16:06:48 [Zakim]
+??P20
16:06:58 [Zakim]
+??P18
16:07:05 [Wilco]
tom: are we going to pick one example to annotate?
16:07:08 [mbertoni]
zakim, ??P20 is mbertoni
16:07:08 [Zakim]
+mbertoni; got it
16:07:32 [shadi]
zakim, ? is Michael
16:07:32 [Zakim]
+Michael; got it
16:12:10 [Wilco]
shadi: how do we present annotations
16:12:43 [shadi]
http://www.w3.org/WAI/EO/2005/Demo/features
16:13:06 [Wilco]
shadi: we should not have all the issues on the page listed
16:14:07 [Wilco]
shadi: we should try not to be repetitive
16:14:53 [Michael]
zakim, mute me
16:14:53 [Zakim]
Michael should now be muted
16:15:24 [Wilco]
wilco: how about listing different elements and name their issues
16:16:06 [Wilco]
shadi: lets take a tick and write down the fix
16:16:21 [Michael]
zakim, unmute me
16:16:21 [Zakim]
Michael should no longer be muted
16:16:22 [Wilco]
shadi: and add a link to the respective technique
16:16:25 [mbertoni]
agree
16:17:07 [Wilco]
shadi: tom should make an exaustive evaluation
16:17:20 [Wilco]
shadi: work with EO to get annotations
16:17:26 [shadi]
http://www.w3.org/WAI/EO/2005/Demo/features
16:17:41 [Wilco]
shadi: different types of barriers are listed
16:18:11 [Wilco]
tom: do we want to include what we did for waiage
16:18:11 [Michael]
q+
16:18:14 [Wilco]
shadi: yes
16:18:48 [shadi]
ack m
16:19:43 [Wilco]
michael: propose make a link from annotations to feature issues, from there link to techniques
16:20:42 [Wilco]
michael: we need a rough idea how to present it
16:20:57 [Wilco]
shadi: agree
16:22:31 [Wilco]
michael: in the list of issues mark those that we want to describe in annotations
16:22:32 [shadi]
http://www.tomjewett.com/badtf/WCAG-techniques-table.html
16:23:49 [Wilco]
wilco: i'll make a proposal
16:24:09 [Tom]
q+
16:24:57 [shadi]
action: wilco to improve the design of the annotations (to make them more descriptive rather than based on Success Criteria and Techniques)
16:25:00 [shadi]
ack t
16:25:29 [Michael]
zakim, mute me
16:25:29 [Zakim]
Michael should now be muted
16:26:57 [Wilco]
tom: how are we going to do the evaluation?
16:27:09 [Michael]
zakim, unmute me
16:27:09 [Zakim]
Michael should no longer be muted
16:27:28 [Michael]
q+
16:27:51 [Wilco]
shadi: the question is how to present the evaluation, they're not related to inbetween pages
16:28:23 [shadi]
ack m
16:28:24 [Michael]
ack m
16:29:14 [Wilco]
michael: we should link from the annotation to the evaluation
16:29:25 [shadi]
http://www.w3.org/WAI/EO/2005/Demo/features
16:30:03 [mbertoni]
zakim, mute me
16:30:03 [Zakim]
mbertoni should now be muted
16:30:07 [Wilco]
shadi: people mght get confused
16:30:30 [Wilco]
tom: i'll look into that
16:30:33 [shadi]
http://fiers.name/badtf/inbetween_after.html
16:30:58 [mbertoni]
zakim, unmute me
16:30:58 [Zakim]
mbertoni should no longer be muted
16:31:57 [Wilco]
all: looks nice
16:32:03 [mbertoni]
agree
16:32:55 [Wilco]
shadi: title and alt should be sufficient, no hover needed
16:33:29 [Wilco]
tom: we don't need it
16:36:23 [Wilco]
shadi: note that there is quite a lot of space to add information in the lightbox
16:37:23 [Michael]
q+
16:37:46 [shadi]
ack m
16:37:53 [Wilco]
wilco: lets make clicking the background disable the dialog
16:37:58 [mbertoni]
agree
16:38:35 [Michael]
+1
16:39:11 [Michael]
q+
16:39:22 [eric]
q+
16:39:47 [shadi]
ack m
16:40:01 [shadi]
ack e
16:40:13 [eric]
http://stockholm.se/
16:41:20 [Wilco]
michael: add visual emph on elements that are tabbed at
16:41:38 [shadi]
zakim, take up next
16:41:38 [Zakim]
agendum 2. "Survey page" taken up [from shadi]
16:41:53 [shadi]
http://www.semplicemente.org/_test/EOWG/BAD/form.html
16:42:01 [shadi]
http://www.semplicemente.org/_test/EOWG/BAD/form_2.html
16:42:16 [shadi]
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-wai-eo-badtf/2009Mar/0001
16:44:06 [mbertoni]
http://www.w3.org/TR/html401/interact/forms.html#h-17.10
16:44:08 [Wilco]
marco: agree with eric's comments on the page
16:45:24 [Wilco]
marco: in the 1st version is semanticly wrong, because the questions aren't legends
16:47:00 [Wilco]
wilco: the second version is more commonly used
16:47:15 [Wilco]
marco: the repeating legend is a problem in the second version
16:47:37 [Michael]
q+
16:47:54 [shadi]
ack m
16:49:48 [Wilco]
marco: jaws might be an older version
16:51:31 [eric]
q+
16:51:49 [Wilco]
marco: we should follow the html specifications of fieldset
16:52:22 [Michael]
q+
16:53:25 [Wilco]
michael: keep it in the old structure
16:54:44 [Wilco]
michael: i think it's important for fieldsets to be in the places that add understanding
16:55:42 [Wilco]
shadi: this page is really difficult
16:56:00 [shadi]
ack e
16:56:00 [Wilco]
shadi: the questions provide different types of challenges
16:56:13 [Wilco]
eric: we could have fieldsets in fieldsets
16:57:08 [Wilco]
marco: i'll redesign according to eric's suggestion
16:58:55 [Wilco]
shadi: fieldsets in fieldsets doesn't show headings for screenreaders
16:59:25 [shadi]
ack m
16:59:42 [Wilco]
michael: we have to think about the structure of the form
17:01:07 [Wilco]
marco: should we leave the first version, and go on from the 2nd?
17:01:17 [Wilco]
shadi: continue experementing
17:02:07 [Zakim]
-Michael
17:02:59 [shadi]
agenda?
17:03:17 [shadi]
zakim, agendum 5
17:03:17 [Zakim]
I don't understand 'agendum 5', shadi
17:03:45 [shadi]
zakim, take up agendum 5
17:03:45 [Zakim]
agendum 5. "Next meetings" taken up [from shadi]
17:03:50 [Wilco]
tom: no need for comments on my table
17:03:58 [Wilco]
shadi: we still need it
17:05:12 [Zakim]
-Tom
17:05:15 [Zakim]
-mbertoni
17:05:16 [Zakim]
-Shadi
17:05:17 [Zakim]
-Wilco
17:05:17 [Zakim]
-Eric
17:05:19 [Wilco]
Wilco has left #badtf
17:05:20 [Zakim]
-Maik
17:05:22 [Zakim]
WAI_EOWG(BAD TF)11:00AM has ended
17:05:23 [Zakim]
Attendees were Tom, Wilco, Shadi, Eric, Maik, mbertoni, Michael
17:06:11 [shadi]
rrsagent, make logs world
17:06:15 [shadi]
rrsagent, make minutes
17:06:15 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2009/03/04-badtf-minutes.html shadi
17:06:18 [shadi]
rrsagent, make logs world
17:06:27 [shadi]
rssagent, bye
17:06:35 [shadi]
rrsagent, bye
17:06:35 [RRSAgent]
I see 1 open action item saved in http://www.w3.org/2009/03/04-badtf-actions.rdf :
17:06:35 [RRSAgent]
ACTION: wilco to improve the design of the annotations (to make them more descriptive rather than based on Success Criteria and Techniques) [1]
17:06:35 [RRSAgent]
recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/03/04-badtf-irc#T16-24-57