09:30:26 RRSAgent has joined #bpwg 09:30:26 logging to http://www.w3.org/2008/02/20-bpwg-irc 09:30:28 RRSAgent, make logs public 09:30:30 Zakim, this will be BPWG 09:30:30 ok, trackbot-ng, I see MWI_BPWG(BPPRO)4:30AM already started 09:30:31 Meeting: Mobile Web Best Practices Working Group Teleconference 09:30:31 Date: 20 February 2008 09:30:57 Chair: Kai 09:31:23 +??P2 09:31:28 zakim, who is here? 09:31:28 On the phone I see Phil_Archer, +03491121aaaa, ??P2 09:31:29 On IRC I see RRSAgent, Zakim, Kai, PhilA, alanchuter, francois, jo, trackbot-ng, dom 09:31:47 zakim, aaaa is alanchuter 09:31:47 +alanchuter; got it 09:32:14 zakim, who is noisy 09:32:14 I don't understand 'who is noisy', Kai 09:32:25 zakim, who makes noise? 09:32:25 I don't understand your question, francois. 09:32:31 zakim, who is making noise 09:32:31 I don't understand 'who is making noise', alanchuter 09:32:54 zakim, who is making noise? 09:33:02 zakim, mite me 09:33:02 I don't understand 'mite me', PhilA 09:33:06 Kai, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: alanchuter (76%) 09:33:08 zakim, mute me 09:33:09 Phil_Archer should now be muted 09:33:47 zakim, unmute me 09:33:47 Phil_Archer should no longer be muted 09:33:48 zakim, who is making noise? 09:33:59 alanchuter, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: Phil_Archer (62%), ??P2 (46%) 09:34:21 Are folks on IRC joining the call? 09:34:58 scribe: PhilA 09:35:04 scribeNick:PhilA 09:35:21 Topic: mobileOK Pro Tests document 09:35:50 Kai: lets begin... Alan, can you restate the point you made on the list? 09:35:52 zakim, unmute me 09:35:52 alanchuter should no longer be muted 09:35:58 s/lets/let's/ 09:36:14 zakim, code? 09:36:14 the conference code is 27776 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 tel:+33.4.89.06.34.99 tel:+44.117.370.6152), jo 09:36:18 Alan: Firstly that we should be clear whether we're going to be limited by BP or if we're going to go beyond the BP 09:36:36 Alan: We can say that mOK goes beyond BP but they'll need to be made aware of that 09:36:44 Alan: I think sme Basic tests already go beyond BP 09:36:48 s/sme/some/ 09:36:51 +jo 09:37:22 Alan: I think it's going to be a mistake to use the BP names for the names of the tests is the latter goes beyond the former. May we could just use numbers 09:37:32 ... and then say that this test relates to or is inspired by [BP] 09:37:37 Kai: I think you're right 09:37:40 rrsagent, draft minutes 09:37:40 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/02/20-bpwg-minutes.html jo 09:37:52 ... we should flag where we go beyond the BP 09:38:13 ... we're trying to be educational. Maybe we can say here's the BP but look you can be even better 09:38:22 rrsagent, make logs member 09:38:30 ... let's not confuse the issue, we're chartered to be based on the Basic test 09:38:50 rrsagent, draft minutes 09:38:50 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/02/20-bpwg-minutes.html jo 09:39:00 Alan: I understood that we're creating the basis for a label. If we're going to go beyond BP then maybe we end up with an appendix to BP 09:39:14 kai: We'll need to reference/flag 09:40:20 + +0783371aabb 09:40:27 zakim, mute me 09:40:27 alanchuter should now be muted 09:40:29 drooks has joined #bpwg 09:41:08 q+ to say what I just said in an email to the list 09:42:04 Further discussion on this point 09:42:19 ack Jo 09:42:19 jo, you wanted to say what I just said in an email to the list 09:43:03 Jo: I don't see that there's a need to be very strict about this. If there's something that simply isn't mentioned in BP and the test was way off the mark, then we'd have to say that Pro had gone too far 09:43:42 ... but there are lots of cases where you can interpret the BPs and retain the spirit of the BP by giving more specific conditions 09:44:07 ... I don't think you should see the BPs as a prescriptive list of things to be testable 09:44:32 PROPOSED RESOLUTION: If anything within the tests goes beyond what is listed in the Best Practices, it should be clearly flagged within the test as a recommendation for further considertation. Furthermore we may later produce a separate document stemming from these changes. 09:44:43 ... I see BPs as more of a fireside chat. "say use caching".. and then be ready in the tests to explain what that actually means with limits 09:45:36 zakim, unmute me 09:45:36 alanchuter should no longer be muted 09:45:49 Kai: When we notice something that is not quite right, then I think we should flag it. We may decide to remove those flags in the doc but we should flag it for discussion within the full WG 09:45:58 Jo: That seems very sensible 09:46:07 Jo: For Basic it's water under the bridge 09:46:44 Kai: Bryan may want to take some of our commnets up in BP2 09:47:04 Kai: I'd like to move on... 09:47:55 zakim, mute me 09:47:55 alanchuter should now be muted 09:47:58 Kai: I am creating an editor's draft version of the doc we've been working on on Google docs (http://docs.google.com/Doc?docid=dft77cn8_15dxsxg5hf&hl=en) 09:48:04 zakim, unmute me 09:48:04 alanchuter should no longer be muted 09:49:20 Present: Kai, PhilA, Alan, DRooks, Jo(Lurking) 09:49:24 PROPOSED RESOLUTION: That editing of the doc is now in Kai's hands and the shared document on Google Docs is no longer the active document 09:50:01 RRSAgent, make logs public 09:50:55 RESOLUTION: That editing of the doc is now in Kai's hands and the shared document on Google Docs is no longer active 09:51:43 kai: The otherr thing is the charter. I sent a new version to the group. Francois has created the group home page and included the amended charter. That might be a problem as it hasn't been approved by the group 09:52:01 s/otherr/other/ 09:52:06 rrsagent, draft minutes 09:52:06 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/02/20-bpwg-minutes.html jo 09:52:51 PhilA; Is there stuff we should be doing between now and this time next week? 09:52:59 Kai: I don't think so, things have been done 09:52:59 adam has joined #bpwg 09:53:16 Topic: Next Steps 09:53:48 PhilA: Presenting the doc to the group is likely to generate action items for us 09:54:14 q+ to note that the first resolution of the call is still a proposed resolution 09:54:16 kai: Forgot that we want to ask for FPWD when we submit this doc 09:54:52 q- 09:54:56 04 01PROPOSED RESOLUTION: If anything within the tests goes beyond what is listed in the Best Practices, it should be clearly flagged within the test as a recommendation for further considertation. Furthermore we may later produce a separate document stemming from these changes. 09:55:08 +1 09:55:10 RESOLUTION: If anything within the tests goes beyond what is listed in the Best Practices, it should be clearly flagged within the test as a recommendation for further considertation. Furthermore we may later produce a separate document stemming from these changes. 09:55:51 Kai: So getting the doc edited and FPWD is the next step 09:55:58 Kai: Can we share the editing? 09:56:10 zakim, mute me 09:56:10 alanchuter should now be muted 09:56:35 PhilA: We can pass control between people 09:56:41 Kai: Yeah that's a pain 09:56:48 kai: Let me see how I get on 09:57:11 Kai: AOB? 09:57:41 rrsagent, generate minutes 09:57:41 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/02/20-bpwg-minutes.html PhilA 09:57:56 - +0783371aabb 09:57:57 -Phil_Archer 09:57:57 -alanchuter 09:58:00 -??P2 09:58:02 -jo 09:58:03 MWI_BPWG(BPPRO)4:30AM has ended 09:58:04 Attendees were Phil_Archer, +03491121aaaa, alanchuter, jo, +0783371aabb 09:58:18 Francois, how do I close this properly? 09:58:30 rrsagent, make logs public 09:58:37 rrsagent, make minutes 09:58:37 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2008/02/20-bpwg-minutes.html jo 09:59:09 s/Phil/Kai 09:59:10 bye Zakim 09:59:18 zakim, bye 09:59:18 Zakim has left #bpwg 09:59:19 zakim, bye 09:59:23 rrsagent, bye 09:59:23 I see no action items