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Chatlog 2009-09-30
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<sandro> Guest: Todd Vincent <sandro> Scribe: Bennett <sandro> Chair: Sheridan 12:53:38 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #egov 12:53:38 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2009/09/30-egov-irc 12:53:42 <Zakim> Zakim has joined #egov 12:53:47 <sandro> zakim, this wil be egov 12:53:47 <Zakim> I don't understand 'this wil be egov', sandro 12:53:54 <sandro> zakim, this will be egov 12:53:54 <Zakim> ok, sandro; I see T&S_EGOV()9:00AM scheduled to start in 7 minutes 12:58:28 <Zakim> T&S_EGOV()9:00AM has now started 12:58:35 <Zakim> + +1.202.651.aaaa 12:59:14 <Daniel_Bennett> aaaa is Daniel Bennett 12:59:17 <Zakim> +johnlsheridan 13:00:35 <Zakim> + +1.202.441.aabb 13:00:39 <Daniel_Bennett> note Daniel is in noisy coffee house. I will stay on mute and type. (chance I may need to leave at 10am) 13:00:54 <Zakim> + +1.410.992.aacc 13:01:05 <Daniel_Bennett> hi Joe 13:01:12 <Daniel_Bennett> remind Joe to go on IRC 13:01:46 <Daniel_Bennett> and that way he can send links 13:02:18 <Daniel_Bennett> thanks John 13:02:21 <Zakim> + +1.303.748.aadd 13:02:43 <Zakim> +Brand 13:04:02 <Zakim> - +1.303.748.aadd 13:04:08 <Zakim> + +1.859.408.aaee 13:04:09 <Zakim> +Sandro 13:04:17 <sandro> zakim, who is talking? 13:04:33 <Zakim> sandro, listening for 11 seconds I heard sound from the following: +1.410.992.aacc (8%), +1.859.408.aaee (83%) 13:04:38 <Zakim> -Brand 13:04:39 <sandro> zakim, drop aaee 13:04:40 <Zakim> + +1.303.748.aaff 13:04:40 <Zakim> +1.859.408.aaee is being disconnected 13:04:41 <Zakim> - +1.859.408.aaee 13:05:03 <joec> joec has joined #egov 13:05:12 <Zakim> +Brand 13:05:21 <sandro> Hey +1-859-408 person -- you were causing LOUD static on the line. 13:05:23 <Daniel_Bennett> i miss jose's hold music 13:06:01 <Zakim> +kevin 13:06:30 <sandro> zakim, who is on the call? 13:06:30 <Zakim> On the phone I see +1.202.651.aaaa, johnlsheridan (muted), +1.202.441.aabb, +1.410.992.aacc, Sandro, +1.303.748.aaff (muted), Brand, kevin 13:06:45 <Zakim> + +1.859.408.aagg 13:06:51 <Daniel_Bennett> Daniel says hi to Kevin 13:07:05 <Daniel_Bennett> 651 is daniel 13:07:11 <Daniel_Bennett> that's me 13:07:14 <Daniel_Bennett> on mute 13:07:24 <sandro> zakim, aaaa is Daniel_Bennett 13:07:24 <Zakim> +Daniel_Bennett; got it 13:07:27 <Daniel_Bennett> I did at beginning 13:07:48 <sandro> zakim, aabb is George_Thomas 13:07:48 <Zakim> +George_Thomas; got it 13:08:15 <sandro> zakim, aacc is Joe_Carmel 13:08:15 <Zakim> +Joe_Carmel; got it 13:08:19 <sandro> zakim, who is on the call? 13:08:19 <Zakim> On the phone I see Daniel_Bennett, johnlsheridan (muted), George_Thomas, Joe_Carmel, Sandro, +1.303.748.aaff (muted), Brand, kevin, +1.859.408.aagg 13:08:40 <sandro> zakim, aaff is Brian_Gryth 13:08:40 <Zakim> +Brian_Gryth; got it 13:08:57 <sandro> zakim, aagg is Todd_Vincent 13:08:57 <Zakim> +Todd_Vincent; got it 13:09:05 <sandro> zakim, who is on the call? 13:09:05 <Zakim> On the phone I see Daniel_Bennett, johnlsheridan (muted), George_Thomas, Joe_Carmel, Sandro, Brian_Gryth (muted), Brand, kevin, Todd_Vincent 13:09:13 <Daniel_Bennett> Sandro: asking for phone participants 13:09:25 <Daniel_Bennett> Sandro: reading out roll 13:09:30 <johnlsheridan> unmute me 13:09:37 <sandro> zakim, unmute johnlsheridan 13:09:37 <Zakim> johnlsheridan should no longer be muted 13:10:13 <Daniel_Bennett> John: first thing on the agenda is the 14th of Nov. any scribe volunteers? 13:10:27 <Daniel_Bennett> John: picks himself... graciously 13:10:49 <Daniel_Bennett> John: that is the 14th of Oct 13:11:29 <sandro> action-1? 13:11:29 <trackbot> ACTION-1 -- Ari Schwartz to open a new section in the wiki for use cases for his TF -- due 2008-07-02 -- CLOSED 13:11:29 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2007/eGov/IG/track/actions/1 13:11:50 <Daniel_Bennett> John: review of open items. please post link to IRC 13:11:53 <sandro> http://www.w3.org/2007/eGov/IG/track/actions/open 13:12:54 <Daniel_Bennett> John: Action 3 and 14 are old. 70 has moved on, first with Keven. 13:13:25 <Daniel_Bennett> Kevin: original white paper, has been met/superceded by Data.gov response 13:13:43 <sandro> close action-70 13:13:43 <trackbot> ACTION-70 draft white paper closed 13:13:47 <Daniel_Bennett> Kevin: we have moved on from original 13:13:54 <Daniel_Bennett> John: close 70 13:14:34 <Daniel_Bennett> John: leave 14 open and check on Action 3 13:14:40 <sandro> zakim, who is talking? 13:14:50 <Zakim> sandro, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: johnlsheridan (4%), Joe_Carmel (9%), kevin (81%) 13:14:57 <Daniel_Bennett> Kevin: leave Action 3 open. still looking into partnership/etc 13:15:37 <Daniel_Bennett> John: Action 71 was Jose. There is a working draft on HTML5 and RDFa? 13:15:58 <Daniel_Bennett> Sandro: Doesn't know 13:16:17 <Daniel_Bennett> Daniel: is working on it 13:16:45 <sandro> close action-84 13:16:45 <trackbot> ACTION-84 Support and reach out to other AC reps to encourage support of eGov Charter closed 13:16:46 <Daniel_Bennett> Daniel: talked with Kevin and will have more next meeting 13:16:54 <Daniel_Bennett> John: closing 84 13:17:24 <Daniel_Bennett> John: Action 89 is still on 13:17:59 <Daniel_Bennett> John: question about attending by Kevin suggested by Sharron 13:18:29 <Daniel_Bennett> Kevin: about attending TPAC 13:18:41 <Zakim> + +1.404.822.aahh 13:18:41 <Daniel_Bennett> so where does it stand? 13:19:05 <Daniel_Bennett> Kevin: still on me 13:19:31 <Daniel_Bennett> John: Action 92. reach out to agencies 13:19:40 <Daniel_Bennett> Kevin: yes, leave it open 13:19:57 <Daniel_Bennett> John: Action 93 on Sandro 13:20:20 <Daniel_Bennett> Sandro: no responses so close Action 93 13:20:45 <Daniel_Bennett> John: leave it open and now push it as item for others to do 13:20:52 <sandro> revise action as: try to get people to use it... 13:20:56 <Daniel_Bennett> John: let's move on to Charter review 13:21:11 <josema> josema has joined #egov 13:21:31 <sandro> http://www.w3.org/2009/06/eGov/ig-charter 13:22:01 <Daniel_Bennett> Sandro: can say that it looks good but no official 13:22:12 <Daniel_Bennett> Kevin: has heard good feedback 13:22:31 <Daniel_Bennett> Kevin: possibility of getting additional assistance 13:22:37 <Zakim> -Todd_Vincent 13:22:48 <Zakim> +??P30 13:22:53 <Daniel_Bennett> Sandro: we got healthy 15 or so comments on Charter 13:22:55 <josema> zakim, ??P30 is me 13:22:55 <Zakim> +josema; got it 13:23:08 <Daniel_Bennett> John: next steps. internal review in w3c 13:23:21 <Daniel_Bennett> Sandro: next week is now set for review 13:23:35 <josema> agenda? 13:23:42 <Daniel_Bennett> John: any questions on the charter review? 13:23:45 <Daniel_Bennett> silence 13:23:50 <Daniel_Bennett> more silence 13:23:54 <sandro> sandro has changed the topic to: next IG call: Sep 30, AGENDA: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-egov-ig/2009Sep/0028.html 13:24:06 <josema> zakim, who's here? 13:24:06 <Zakim> On the phone I see Daniel_Bennett, johnlsheridan, George_Thomas, Joe_Carmel, Sandro, Brian_Gryth (muted), Brand, kevin, +1.404.822.aahh, josema 13:24:08 <Zakim> On IRC I see josema, joec, Zakim, RRSAgent, Daniel_Bennett, johnlsheridan, hughb, sandro, trackbot 13:24:12 <Daniel_Bennett> John: lets move on to next agenda. where do we go on from here. 13:24:29 <sandro> Topic: Where to go from here? 13:24:31 <josema> regrets+ rachel 13:24:43 <Daniel_Bennett> John: in particular within scope of charter 13:25:24 <Daniel_Bennett> John: what would make the participants happy doing? 13:25:45 <Daniel_Bennett> Joe: throws something out. at face to face... we talked about best practices 13:26:48 <Daniel_Bennett> Daniel: call for use cases. compiling them. analysis of uses cases. value add on what gov does. 13:27:04 <Daniel_Bennett> Joe: about cataloging the data 13:27:27 <Daniel_Bennett> Joe: what is the data that govs actually have and what can be done 13:27:54 <Daniel_Bennett> Joe: those are the two things that interest me. 13:28:34 <Daniel_Bennett> John: most efforts into government data piece. esp. linked data 13:28:57 <Daniel_Bennett> Daniel: can we go round robin asking folks on the call? 13:29:17 <sandro> zakim, who is on the call? 13:29:17 <Zakim> On the phone I see Daniel_Bennett, johnlsheridan, George_Thomas, Joe_Carmel, Sandro, Brian_Gryth (muted), Brand, kevin, +1.404.822.aahh, josema 13:29:20 <AdamHarvey> AdamHarvey has joined #egov 13:29:46 <Daniel_Bennett> thanks 13:29:57 <Daniel_Bennett> on mute 13:29:59 <Zakim> +AdamHarvey 13:30:10 <Daniel_Bennett> so cant talk 13:30:13 <Daniel_Bennett> ah 13:30:15 <AdamHarvey> Sorry I'm late! 13:30:40 <Daniel_Bennett> I am looking to see finding use cases and comparing to best practices 13:30:54 <Daniel_Bennett> and evaluating according to w3c standards 13:31:21 <sandro> Kevin: EO group includes linked data, but also all the Web 1.0 stuff, including accessibility, etc. 13:31:23 <Daniel_Bennett> and also cataloging use cases with analysis/annotation 13:31:31 <Daniel_Bennett> (reminder on mute) 13:32:11 <sandro> zakim, who is talking? 13:32:21 <Zakim> sandro, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: Daniel_Bennett (35%), johnlsheridan (4%), Brand (90%) 13:32:38 <Daniel_Bennett> Brand: how we can get more involved in data.gov 13:32:54 <Daniel_Bennett> Brand: especially in approaching Vivek Kundra 13:33:13 <Daniel_Bennett> Brand: data.gov effort looking to RDFa 13:34:10 <Daniel_Bennett> Kevin: reached out and the feedback was that a govt only group. only employees. I stated we are ready to help here at W3C egov. 13:34:13 <johnlsheridan> doesn't the memo say gov is participative? 13:35:52 <Daniel_Bennett> Brand: still closed 13:36:23 <Daniel_Bennett> Brand: hoping this group can be part. data.gov looks like RDFa positive. 13:36:24 <josema> I believe George referred to this doc with his comments: http://george.thomas.name/omb/HHS_Comments_Data.gov_Conops.doc 13:37:29 <AdamHarvey> Thanks, Jose... 13:38:13 <sandro> (um, who is speaking?) 13:38:25 <johnlsheridan> George 13:38:31 <sandro> (thanks) 13:38:49 <Daniel_Bennett> George: speaking to data.gov 13:39:11 <Daniel_Bennett> George: stated the URL for his comments 13:39:42 <Daniel_Bennett> (who is speaking? please announce yourself before speaking. thanks) 13:40:01 <johnlsheridan> currently it is brand 13:40:23 <Daniel_Bennett> Brand: Ontology and data models for government. Brand is leading part of the effort. 13:40:58 <Daniel_Bennett> Brand: mentions the conferences next week 13:41:22 <AdamHarvey> Speak up Daniel... 13:41:47 <sandro> Daniel: I'll be speaking at the XBRL+W3C conference next week. If anyone is interested go to .... 13:42:03 <sandro> http://www.w3.org/2009/03/xbrl/cfp.html 13:42:20 <Daniel_Bennett> yes, thanks sandro 13:42:31 <tb> tb has joined #egov 13:42:56 <Daniel_Bennett> and Diane Mueller 13:43:22 <josema> zakim, who's here? 13:43:22 <Zakim> On the phone I see Daniel_Bennett, johnlsheridan (muted), George_Thomas, Joe_Carmel, Sandro, Brian_Gryth (muted), Brand, kevin, +1.404.822.aahh, josema, AdamHarvey 13:43:23 <Daniel_Bennett> Kevin: several folks will be there 13:43:26 <Zakim> On IRC I see tb, AdamHarvey, josema, joec, Zakim, RRSAgent, Daniel_Bennett, johnlsheridan, hughb, sandro, trackbot 13:43:29 <Daniel_Bennett> silence 13:43:34 <josema> john, if you are speaking, you are muted! 13:43:45 <Vagner> Vagner has joined #egov 13:44:14 <Daniel_Bennett> he is on mute again 13:44:18 <Daniel_Bennett> take him off 13:44:21 <johnlsheridan> can you hear me 13:44:24 <josema> ack jo 13:44:30 <sandro> zakim, who is on the call? 13:44:30 <Zakim> On the phone I see Daniel_Bennett, johnlsheridan (muted), George_Thomas, Joe_Carmel, Sandro, Brian_Gryth (muted), Brand, kevin, +1.404.822.aahh, josema, AdamHarvey 13:44:33 <johnlsheridan> I'll dial back in 13:44:35 <Daniel_Bennett> it says he is muted 13:44:35 <josema> zakim, unmute johnlsheridan 13:44:35 <Zakim> johnlsheridan should no longer be muted 13:45:15 <Zakim> + +49.178.404.aaii 13:45:40 <Daniel_Bennett> John: asking around about participants interest. 13:46:01 <tb> Thomas bandholtz is calling from Germany 13:46:21 <sandro> zakim, aaii is Thomas_Bandholtz 13:46:21 <Daniel_Bennett> Adam: already on ETF. wants to help translate techspeak especially for local govts 13:46:23 <Zakim> +Thomas_Bandholtz; got it 13:46:45 <Daniel_Bennett> John: this is consistent with our efforts 13:46:46 <Zakim> +??P35 13:49:05 <Daniel_Bennett> Jose: working on a couple of projects. spending most of time on projects that open gov data involved. 13:50:03 <Zakim> + +1.202.270.aajj 13:50:37 <Daniel_Bennett> Jose: we still need to put out W3Cstandards. dealing with proprietary formats. 13:51:54 <Daniel_Bennett> Jose: it is complicating the point of open gov data 13:51:54 <Daniel_Bennett> Joe: are you chartered to look at cataloging gov looking at standards. 13:51:57 <Daniel_Bennett> Kevin: a lot of agencies dealing with legacy data. 13:51:59 <Daniel_Bennett> Kevin: how can we aid agencies with this problem set. 13:52:01 <Daniel_Bennett> we should address those that need 100% solutions for data to be useful vs. those that can just move on with new data. 13:52:16 <Daniel_Bennett> missed. who is speaking 13:52:30 <josema> we are building a number of transformers, but it's hard and most are adhoc due to how legacy data was archived :( 13:53:05 <Daniel_Bennett> Brian: Local govt need esp. help on this. this is my interest with outreach to locals. 13:54:06 <Daniel_Bennett> John: we have similar issue. my experience does not hire those folks 13:55:56 <Daniel_Bennett> Brian: no money for this work 13:58:19 <Daniel_Bennett> Joe: talking about just having raw data. and then allow others to overlay documentation. 13:58:42 <Daniel_Bennett> Brian: lets at least catalog. 13:59:28 <Daniel_Bennett> how about open sourcing the conversion of gov docs. like recaptcha 13:59:30 <Daniel_Bennett> ? 14:00:18 <Daniel_Bennett> Joe: it is possible to do PDF things like include embedded xml and named locations. 14:00:38 <Zakim> -Brand 14:00:49 <Daniel_Bennett> Daniel: that is not standard practice and does not apply to legacy docs. and adobe looking to Mars Project. 14:01:49 <Daniel_Bennett> Brian: resources lack and IT lack is holding folks back. 14:02:27 <Daniel_Bennett> Brian: human speak is better than geek speak at getting gov folks to see importance of good data practices 14:03:04 <Daniel_Bennett> John: is there anyone more to speak? 14:05:13 <Daniel_Bennett> ThomasB: Inspire project 14:05:29 <Daniel_Bennett> (missed part due to phone and hard to hear) 14:05:56 <Daniel_Bennett> John: i am on the Inspire project 14:06:20 <Daniel_Bennett> John: looking to this for implementation. 14:06:24 <sandro> http://inspire.jrc.ec.europa.eu/ Inspire, Spacial Data Infrastructure 14:06:55 <johnlsheridan> it's all very top down 14:07:25 <Daniel_Bennett> ThomasB: project of mashups with Google maps ... 14:09:16 <Zakim> -kevin 14:09:22 <Daniel_Bennett> ThomasB: we are publishing more 14:09:45 <Daniel_Bennett> ThomasB: from outside of Inspire. see how it can be linked up. 14:10:14 <Daniel_Bennett> John: some of the problems and issues related to the law versus what is possible. 14:10:38 <Daniel_Bennett> John: last call for participants. 14:10:41 <josema> zakim, who's here? 14:10:41 <Zakim> On the phone I see Daniel_Bennett, johnlsheridan, George_Thomas, Joe_Carmel, Sandro, Brian_Gryth, +1.404.822.aahh, josema, AdamHarvey, Thomas_Bandholtz, ??P35, +1.202.270.aajj 14:10:45 <Zakim> On IRC I see Vagner, tb, AdamHarvey, josema, joec, Zakim, RRSAgent, Daniel_Bennett, johnlsheridan, hughb, sandro, trackbot 14:10:54 <Daniel_Bennett> Todd: has been lurking this group. 14:11:01 <josema> zakim, aajj is probably Todd_Vincent 14:11:01 <Zakim> +Todd_Vincent; got it 14:11:02 <Daniel_Bennett> Todd: interested in web standards. 14:11:25 <Daniel_Bennett> Sandro: personal interest. help provide with tech stuff. 14:11:31 <johnlsheridan> http://blogs.cabinetoffice.gov.uk/digitalengagement/post/2009/09/30/Calling-Open-Data-Developers-We-need-your-help.aspx 14:12:08 <Daniel_Bennett> John: on issue of linked data.. soft launch of data.gov like service 14:12:20 <sandro> johnlsheridan: We're doing the VERY SOFT launch of the UK equiv of data.gov today. Preview access on request. 14:12:24 <Daniel_Bennett> John: ask for log in to see 14:12:51 <Daniel_Bennett> John: if you go to link then go to google group 14:12:51 <AdamHarvey> http://groups.google.com/group/uk-government-data-developers/ 14:13:52 <josema> zakim, ??P35 is probably vagner 14:13:52 <Zakim> +vagner; got it 14:14:54 <Daniel_Bennett> Vagner: we are developing new stuff for open gov. 14:15:13 <Daniel_Bennett> can you post links Vagner? 14:16:37 <Zakim> -Todd_Vincent 14:17:40 <josema> topic: Legislation and Citations 14:17:40 <joec> http://legislink.org/us 14:17:40 <Zakim> -George_Thomas 14:18:00 <johnlsheridan> People are already building stuff around our legislation API, eg: http://github.com/robmckinnon/legislation-uk 14:18:34 <johnlsheridan> the UK legislation API is at www.legislation.gov.uk - and we're surfacing some RDF too, with more to come. 14:19:27 <Vagner> link to an XML open data project in Brazil: http://projeto.lexml.gov.br/documentacao/resumo-em-ingles 14:19:32 <AdamHarvey> I just got pulled into a meeting,... have to leave. 14:19:38 <Zakim> -AdamHarvey 14:20:20 <Daniel_Bennett> Joe: discussing a method of providing links to gov docs including sub/anchored links 14:20:44 <Daniel_Bennett> Joe: need to help govt w/ overlay 14:21:35 <Daniel_Bennett> Daniel says that having open data, allows overlays like legislink independent of gov. does not keep gov from doing anything. 14:22:27 <Daniel_Bennett> is a value add that can help influence gov. as opposed to current practice of bad data that private firms fix/normalize and then provide expensive access 14:28:08 <Zakim> -Daniel_Bennett 14:29:21 <josema> rrsagent, pointer? 14:29:21 <RRSAgent> See http://www.w3.org/2009/09/30-egov-irc#T14-29-21 14:30:46 <josema> rrsagent, draft minutes 14:30:46 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2009/09/30-egov-minutes.html josema 14:33:33 <josema> [scribe disconnected] 14:33:38 <josema> rrsagent, draft minutes 14:33:38 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2009/09/30-egov-minutes.html josema 14:36:57 <josema> [ADJOURNED] 14:37:27 <Zakim> - +1.404.822.aahh 14:37:29 <Zakim> -Brian_Gryth 14:37:30 <Zakim> -josema 14:37:33 <Zakim> -johnlsheridan 14:37:36 <Zakim> -vagner 14:37:37 <Zakim> -Joe_Carmel 14:37:38 <Zakim> -Sandro 14:37:40 <Zakim> -Thomas_Bandholtz 14:37:41 <Zakim> T&S_EGOV()9:00AM has ended 14:37:42 <Zakim> Attendees were +1.202.651.aaaa, johnlsheridan, +1.202.441.aabb, +1.410.992.aacc, +1.303.748.aadd, Brand, +1.859.408.aaee, Sandro, +1.303.748.aaff, kevin, +1.859.408.aagg, 14:37:45 <Zakim> ... Daniel_Bennett, George_Thomas, Joe_Carmel, Brian_Gryth, Todd_Vincent, +1.404.822.aahh, josema, AdamHarvey, +49.178.404.aaii, Thomas_Bandholtz, +1.202.270.aajj, Todd_Vincent?, 14:37:48 <Zakim> ... vagner? 14:37:55 <joec> thanks everyone 14:40:30 <sandro> RRSAgent, make record public 14:47:12 <joec> still here daniel? 16:42:37 <Zakim> Zakim has left #egov # SPECIAL MARKER FOR CHATSYNC. DO NOT EDIT THIS LINE OR BELOW. SRCLINESUSED=00000291