IRC log of aria on 2016-05-12
Timestamps are in UTC.
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- logging to http://www.w3.org/2016/05/12-aria-irc
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- RRSAgent, make logs world
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- Zakim, this will be
- 16:25:55 [Zakim]
- I don't understand 'this will be', trackbot
- 16:25:56 [trackbot]
- Meeting: Accessible Rich Internet Applications Working Group Teleconference
- 16:25:56 [trackbot]
- Date: 12 May 2016
- 16:26:17 [Rich]
- chair: Rich
- 16:26:23 [Rich]
- RRSAgent, make log public
- 16:28:06 [MichielBijl]
- regrets+ MichielBijl
- 16:29:38 [joanie]
- present+ Joanmarie_Diggs
- 16:31:16 [fesch]
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- 16:33:39 [cyns]
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- 16:34:52 [MichaelC]
- present+ MichaelC
- 16:35:15 [jemma]
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- 16:35:50 [Rich]
- present+ Rich_Schwerdtfeger
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- 16:37:08 [jemma]
- scribe:jaeunJemma
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- rrsagent, make log world
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- present+ mattking
- 16:37:39 [jemma]
- present+joanie
- 16:37:51 [jemma]
- present+ joanie
- 16:38:22 [cyns]
- present+ cyns
- 16:38:31 [jemma]
- *thanks for your help joanie
- 16:38:33 [joanie]
- present- joanie
- 16:38:59 [jemma]
- present+ Joanmarie_Diggs
- 16:39:26 [jemma]
- Chair:Rich_Schwerdtfeger
- 16:40:28 [jemma]
- Topic:combo box
- 16:41:11 [jemma]
- group is talking about combo box email correspondence
- 16:41:47 [jemma]
- Rich: not sure what AT will implement
- 16:42:18 [jemma]
- bryan: current implementation is working so worried about change in case it breaks something
- 16:42:58 [jemma]
- mat: if we use "should" for conformance, it would work
- 16:43:06 [jemma]
- rich: I prefer "should"
- 16:44:28 [jemma]
- rich: does not like to put this in cfc again
- 16:44:39 [jemma]
- rich: we can look into combo box now
- 16:45:03 [janina_]
- present+ Janina
- 16:45:04 [Rich]
- http://rawgit.com/w3c/aria/master/aria/aria.html#combobox
- 16:45:22 [Rich]
- The ARIA 1.0 specification describes a combobox pattern where a text input element has the combobox role and owns a listbox element. User agents and assistive technologies SHOULD continue to support the ARIA 1.0 pattern so that existing implementations of the ARIA 1.0 pattern remain functional.
- 16:46:22 [JF]
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- Present+ JF
- 16:47:11 [jemma]
- matt: do we use the word, "conformance"?
- 16:47:13 [bgaraventa1979]
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- 16:47:24 [jemma]
- matt: yes, we use it
- 16:47:29 [bgaraventa1979]
- present+ Bryan_Garaventa
- 16:47:33 [jemma]
- rich: it is really conformance checker
- 16:47:37 [Rich]
- http://rawgit.com/w3c/aria/master/aria/aria.html#conformance_checkers
- 16:47:55 [jemma]
- matt: joanie, will you change this?
- 16:48:40 [jemma]
- joanie: I am changing it now
- 16:49:13 [jemma]
- rich: I will create resolution
- 16:49:44 [jemma]
- rich: it is "should', not "must"
- 16:51:13 [Rich]
- Group: Agrees to include conformance checkers as the list of technologies that SHOULD allow a role of combobox on an input type fo text.
- 16:51:30 [bgaraventa1979]
- +1
- 16:51:30 [jemma]
- Topic: charing next week
- 16:52:14 [jemma]
- Rich: group have no objection for jania to chair the meting
- 16:52:29 [Rich]
- s/jania/janina/
- 16:52:46 [jemma]
- s/charing/chairing
- 16:53:20 [jemma]
- Rich: any progress for ARIA keyboard shortcut, matt?
- 16:53:24 [jamesn]
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- 16:53:38 [jemma]
- Rich: can it be done before memorial week?
- 16:53:41 [jemma]
- matt: yes
- 16:53:45 [jamesn]
- present+ JamesNurthen
- 16:54:20 [jemma]
- Topic: actioin item 1747
- 16:54:26 [Rich]
- https://rawgit.com/w3c/aria/action-1743/aria/aria.html#aria-activedescendant
- 16:54:32 [jemma]
- s/actionin/action
- 16:55:28 [jemma]
- matt: first change is in definition itself
- 16:56:26 [jemma]
- matt: second change is "author must" statement in third paragraph
- 16:58:03 [jemma]
- matt: "Authors must ensure that one of the following two sets of conditions is met when setting the value of aria-activedescendant on an element with DOM focus:" with specific condition and examples
- 16:58:33 [jemma]
- rich: is there a tree widget?
- 16:59:08 [jemma]
- rich: is there a tree widget in Inherits into Roles?
- 16:59:55 [jemma]
- Rich:I am making sure about the section, "Inherits into Roles"
- 17:00:12 [jemma]
- Joanie: It looks more clear to me with bulleted list items
- 17:00:47 [jemma]
- rich: any objections for Matt's proposal?
- 17:00:51 [joanie]
- s/Joanie: It/Cynthia: It/
- 17:00:58 [jemma]
- Jemma: no objection
- 17:01:21 [Rich]
- https://rawgit.com/w3c/aria/action-1743/aria/aria.html#application
- 17:01:39 [Rich]
- https://rawgit.com/w3c/aria/action-1743/aria/aria.html#aria-activedescendant
- 17:01:57 [jemma]
- Resolution: Accept Matt's revision for action 1743 covering changes to role=application and more
- 17:02:27 [jemma]
- s/and more/ details in the action
- 17:03:49 [jemma]
- Joanie: copied statement should go to AAM
- 17:04:06 [joanie]
- s/Joanie:/Cynthia:/
- 17:04:22 [jemma]
- s/copied/copied below/
- 17:04:46 [Rich]
- Group agrees to remove thest statements: “Some user agents use aria-activedescendant to tell assistive technologies that the active descendant has focus. User agents are not expected to validate that the active descendant is a descendant of the focused container. “
- 17:05:11 [Rich]
- from aria-aria-activedescendant
- 17:06:17 [Rich]
- Action: Cynthia Add this statement to the Core-AAM: “User agents are not expected to validate that the active descendant is a descendant of the focused container. “
- 17:06:18 [trackbot]
- Created ACTION-2065 - Add this statement to the core-aam: “user agents are not expected to validate that the active descendant is a descendant of the focused container. “ [on Cynthia Shelly - due 2016-05-19].
- 17:06:29 [Rich]
- action-2065?
- 17:06:29 [trackbot]
- action-2065 -- Cynthia Shelly to Add this statement to the core-aam: “user agents are not expected to validate that the active descendant is a descendant of the focused container. “ -- due 2016-05-19 -- OPEN
- 17:06:29 [trackbot]
- http://www.w3.org/WAI/ARIA/track/actions/2065
- 17:07:08 [jemma]
- Rich: will get out that for CFC
- 17:07:17 [jemma]
- Topic: action 2015
- 17:07:55 [jemma]
- s/action 2015/action 2059
- 17:08:12 [jemma]
- https://www.w3.org/WAI/ARIA/track/actions/2059
- 17:08:13 [Rich]
- https://www.w3.org/WAI/ARIA/track/actions/2059
- 17:08:13 [joanie]
- action-2059
- 17:08:13 [trackbot]
- action-2059 -- Joanmarie Diggs to Add aria-posinset, aria-setsize as supported states and properties to roles: menutitem, menuitemcheckbox, and menuitemradio -- due 2016-05-05 -- PENDINGREVIEW
- 17:08:13 [trackbot]
- http://www.w3.org/WAI/ARIA/track/actions/2059
- 17:08:28 [joanie]
- https://rawgit.com/w3c/aria/action-2059/aria/aria.html#aria-posinset
- 17:08:36 [joanie]
- https://rawgit.com/w3c/aria/action-2059/aria/aria.html#aria-setsize
- 17:08:42 [joanie]
- https://github.com/w3c/aria/commit/ec2dd6d0
- 17:09:56 [jemma]
- Joanie: did not remove anything, added about posinset, setsize about menuitem
- 17:10:10 [jemma]
- matt: we are going to ask user agent to do this?
- 17:10:24 [jemma]
- matt:because user agents do this things differently
- 17:10:32 [jemma]
- matt: this should author statement
- 17:10:41 [jemma]
- s/should/should be
- 17:11:50 [jemma]
- rich:it is more about mapping spec.
- 17:12:18 [jemma]
- Joanie: matt raise a good point
- 17:13:16 [Rich]
- https://rawgit.com/w3c/aria/master/core-aam/core-aam.html#mapping_additional_position
- 17:13:29 [jcraig]
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- 17:14:11 [jemma]
- joanie: grouping, not with the sense of aria "group" starts differently in some browsers
- 17:14:26 [jemma]
- matt: can we create action for this item?
- 17:16:06 [jemma]
- Joanie: I am happy to give consultation to Joseph if Joseph has this action item.
- 17:16:33 [Rich]
- Action: Joseph include spec. text in 5.6.4 for automatic computation of posinset and setsize for menuitems and their subclasses.
- 17:16:34 [trackbot]
- Created ACTION-2066 - Include spec. text in 5.6.4 for automatic computation of posinset and setsize for menuitems and their subclasses. [on Joseph Scheuhammer - due 2016-05-19].
- 17:16:47 [Rich]
- action-2066?
- 17:16:47 [trackbot]
- action-2066 -- Joseph Scheuhammer to Include spec. text in 5.6.4 for automatic computation of posinset and setsize for menuitems and their subclasses. -- due 2016-05-19 -- OPEN
- 17:16:47 [trackbot]
- http://www.w3.org/WAI/ARIA/track/actions/2066
- 17:17:07 [jemma]
- Rich: any other changes to Joanie's proposal?
- 17:18:17 [jnurthen]
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- 17:18:31 [Rich]
- * https://rawgit.com/w3c/aria/action-2059/aria/aria.html#aria-posinset
- 17:18:32 [Rich]
- * https://rawgit.com/w3c/aria/action-2059/aria/aria.html#aria-setsize
- 17:18:40 [jemma]
- Resolutions: accept Joanie's proposal and send out cfc
- 17:19:02 [jemma]
- s/Resolutions/RESOLUTION/
- 17:19:23 [jemma]
- RESOLUTION: accept Joanie's proposal and send out cfc
- 17:20:27 [jemma]
- rich: no objections to Michael' proposal, host language conflicts.
- 17:20:34 [jamesnurthen]
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- 17:20:36 [Rich]
- https://rawgit.com/w3c/aria/ACTION-1489/aria/aria.html#host_general_conflict
- 17:21:13 [jemma]
- rich: 1489 resolved. michale, do we need add something more?
- 17:21:25 [jemma]
- michale: it looks good enough
- 17:22:16 [jemma]
- michale: do we need clarificaiton for dpub graphic roles?
- 17:22:29 [jemma]
- rich: we don't talk about this in spec. so do we need it here?
- 17:22:52 [jemma]
- michale: I would argue we may need that somewhere in spec.
- 17:23:23 [JF]
- +1 to M Cooper
- 17:23:43 [jemma]
- michale: there may be a question about how dpub graphic role is related to aria in the future.
- 17:24:05 [jemma]
- rich: we should just say "modular extention" in aria 1.1
- 17:24:35 [jemma]
- rich: do you want me leave it open?
- 17:25:00 [jemma]
- michale: it is done for now, I will just add it "modular extenion" here.
- 17:25:17 [Rich]
- https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/wiki/ARIAExtensions
- 17:25:31 [jemma]
- rich: if you want to, you can also include the link to the modular extension.
- 17:26:13 [jemma]
- rich:michale will move to formal working draft.
- 17:27:56 [jemma]
- jania: it would be nice to have it as agenda for next week meeting in regards to michale's work.
- 17:28:05 [Rich]
- s/rich:michale/rich: Michael/
- 17:29:05 [Rich]
- RIch: I will add requirements to (action 1513) review of a public working draft next meeting
- 17:29:22 [jemma]
- Next itme
- 17:29:27 [jemma]
- Next item
- 17:30:34 [Rich]
- https://www.w3.org/WAI/ARIA/track/issues/648
- 17:30:35 [mck]
- action-2040?
- 17:30:35 [trackbot]
- action-2040 -- Michael Cooper to Modify section 7.4 to include role values as native host language semantics in paragraph 2 -- due 2016-03-17 -- OPEN
- 17:30:35 [trackbot]
- http://www.w3.org/WAI/ARIA/track/actions/2040
- 17:31:04 [jemma]
- TOPIC:action 2040
- 17:31:28 [jemma]
- rich: can you look at this next week, Michale?
- 17:31:35 [jemma]
- Michale:Yes
- 17:32:44 [jemma]
- TOPIC:Action 1624
- 17:32:54 [jemma]
- http://www.w3.org/WAI/ARIA/track/actions/1624
- 17:32:56 [mck]
- action-1624?
- 17:32:56 [trackbot]
- action-1624 -- Michael Cooper to Work with shane to develop publication strategy and solution that would exclude abstract roles for authors -- due 2016-03-17 -- OPEN
- 17:32:56 [trackbot]
- http://www.w3.org/WAI/ARIA/track/actions/1624
- 17:33:34 [jemma]
- rich: do you think this is an issue in Microsoft?
- 17:33:46 [jemma]
- cynthia:no
- 17:34:07 [jamesnurthen]
- q+ to say i think it is an issue
- 17:34:54 [jemma]
- Rich: I don't think this is not important issue.
- 17:35:02 [jemma]
- jn: I think it is.
- 17:35:03 [richardschwerdtfeger]
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- 17:35:25 [jemma]
- rich: would rather to push to aria2.2
- 17:35:36 [JF]
- +1 to deferring to ARIA 2.0
- 17:35:41 [joanie]
- +1
- 17:35:44 [jemma]
- rich:any objection for moving this to aria 2.0?
- 17:36:05 [jemma]
- RESOLUTION: move this action 1624 to ARIA 2.0
- 17:36:13 [jemma]
- s/this/
- 17:36:33 [jamesnurthen]
- ack me
- 17:36:33 [Zakim]
- jamesnurthen, you wanted to say i think it is an issue
- 17:37:22 [jemma]
- s/I think it is/I think it is.
- 17:38:25 [jemma]
- TOPIC: action 1560
- 17:38:27 [Rich]
- q?
- 17:38:29 [jemma]
- action-1560
- 17:38:29 [trackbot]
- action-1560 -- Stefan Schnabel to Email list with discussion of on/off value labels (maybe valuetext?) and extending value descriptions to other controls -- due 2016-02-10 -- OPEN
- 17:38:29 [trackbot]
- http://www.w3.org/WAI/ARIA/track/actions/1560
- 17:38:36 [Rich]
- ack
- 17:38:40 [Rich]
- q?
- 17:38:46 [Rich]
- ack Rich
- 17:39:27 [jemma]
- joanie:I would not like to repurpose this
- 17:40:00 [joanie]
- q+ To say that *how* we expose it is irrelevant to user agents having already implemented switch
- 17:40:18 [jemma]
- matt: something like value description is similar role=description, it is not like aria described by like supplemental info.
- 17:40:20 [joanie]
- q- only
- 17:41:15 [jemma]
- matt:what is the scope of value description?
- 17:41:42 [jemma]
- joanie: it is supposed to be bigger scope when we recollect the meeting at TPAC
- 17:42:31 [Rich]
- q+
- 17:42:40 [joanie]
- ack me
- 17:42:40 [Zakim]
- joanie, you wanted to say that *how* we expose it is irrelevant to user agents having already implemented switch
- 17:43:45 [jemma]
- rich: I think customizing widget things is more of ARIA 2
- 17:44:02 [mck]
- +1 for moving to 2.0
- 17:44:09 [joanie]
- +1
- 17:44:13 [Rich]
- +1
- 17:44:23 [jemma]
- RESOLUTION: move action 1560 to ARIA 2.0
- 17:44:43 [Rich]
- Action-1560?
- 17:44:43 [trackbot]
- Action-1560 -- Stefan Schnabel to Email list with discussion of on/off value labels (maybe valuetext?) and extending value descriptions to other controls -- due 2016-02-10 -- OPEN
- 17:44:43 [trackbot]
- http://www.w3.org/WAI/ARIA/track/actions/1560
- 17:45:07 [jemma]
- TOPIC: clean up open action items
- 17:45:33 [mck]
- issue-619?
- 17:45:33 [trackbot]
- issue-619 -- ARIA 1.1 should disallow host languages from declaring @aria-label from being declared in direct semantic conflict with a host language attribute. -- open
- 17:45:33 [trackbot]
- http://www.w3.org/WAI/ARIA/track/issues/619
- 17:46:14 [jemma]
- rich: action 619 is closed and addressed with 1489
- 17:46:58 [jemma]
- matt: this means anytime aria label present, you cannot override with alt or aria-labledby?
- 17:47:26 [jemma]
- rich: yes
- 17:47:45 [jemma]
- action - 648
- 17:47:45 [trackbot]
- Error finding '-'. You can review and register nicknames at <http://www.w3.org/WAI/ARIA/track/users>.
- 17:47:56 [jemma]
- action-648
- 17:47:56 [trackbot]
- Sorry, but action-648 does not exist.
- 17:48:14 [mck]
- issue-695?
- 17:48:14 [trackbot]
- issue-695 -- Clean up nits in the ARIA specification -- open
- 17:48:14 [trackbot]
- http://www.w3.org/WAI/ARIA/track/issues/695
- 17:48:17 [jemma]
- group is going over open action items now
- 17:48:31 [mck]
- issue-701?
- 17:48:31 [trackbot]
- issue-701 -- Modify aria-owns such that the idref order pertains to the order of the associated children -- open
- 17:48:31 [trackbot]
- http://www.w3.org/WAI/ARIA/track/issues/701
- 17:49:08 [jemma]
- matt: I think we already did this work.
- 17:49:22 [jemma]
- rich: I will make sure whether we did it one more time.
- 17:49:40 [Rich]
- http://rawgit.com/w3c/aria/master/aria/aria.html#aria-owns
- 17:50:26 [jemma]
- rich: I don't see the change here.
- 17:51:40 [jemma]
- matt: I remember it is written somewhere.
- 17:51:50 [jamesnurthen]
- it is missing what to do if you have both aria-owns and DOM children
- 17:52:03 [jamesnurthen]
- (and the aim is to combine them)
- 17:52:23 [jemma]
- rich: who will take action on this?
- 17:52:56 [jemma]
- Action:James will try for next week
- 17:53:43 [Rich]
- action: jamesn write text to state the order of aria-owns ids wrt. the DOM child order and sequential aria-owns ids
- 17:53:43 [trackbot]
- Created ACTION-2067 - Write text to state the order of aria-owns ids wrt. the dom child order and sequential aria-owns ids [on James Nurthen - due 2016-05-19].
- 17:53:57 [Rich]
- Action-2067?
- 17:53:57 [trackbot]
- Action-2067 -- James Nurthen to Write text to state the order of aria-owns ids wrt. the dom child order and sequential aria-owns ids -- due 2016-05-19 -- OPEN
- 17:53:57 [trackbot]
- http://www.w3.org/WAI/ARIA/track/actions/2067
- 17:54:30 [jemma]
- joanie: do we really want to permit that?
- 17:54:37 [jemma]
- jn: yes
- 17:56:32 [bgaraventa1979]
- +q
- 17:56:42 [Rich]
- ack Rich
- 17:57:18 [jamesnurthen]
- I would also like to clarify whether child owned elements get pulled in via aria-owns
- 17:57:45 [jemma]
- bryan: I am working this with client now
- 17:58:40 [jemma]
- atcion-1006
- 17:58:49 [jemma]
- action-1006
- 17:58:49 [trackbot]
- Sorry, but action-1006 does not exist.
- 17:58:52 [Rich]
- issue-1006?
- 17:58:52 [trackbot]
- issue-1006 -- The roles that include children presentational = true are not consistent -- open
- 17:58:52 [trackbot]
- http://www.w3.org/WAI/ARIA/track/issues/1006
- 17:59:59 [Rich]
- Action: Bryan address issue 1106
- 18:00:06 [trackbot]
- Created ACTION-2068 - Address issue 1106 [on Bryan Garaventa - due 2016-05-19].
- 18:00:54 [jemma]
- bryan will bring this to the meeting next week.
- 18:01:24 [jemma]
- rrsagent, generate minutes
- 18:01:24 [RRSAgent]
- I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2016/05/12-aria-minutes.html jemma
- 18:01:53 [jemma]
- rrsagent, make minutes
- 18:01:53 [RRSAgent]
- I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2016/05/12-aria-minutes.html jemma
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