IRC log of aria-apg on 2015-11-09

Timestamps are in UTC.

18:03:25 [RRSAgent]
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18:03:25 [RRSAgent]
logging to http://www.w3.org/2015/11/09-aria-apg-irc
18:03:41 [LJWatson]
Meeting: ARIA APG meeting
18:03:50 [LJWatson]
Chair: Matt
18:03:57 [LJWatson]
present+ LJWatson
18:04:05 [LJWatson]
present+ Matt King
18:04:09 [mck]
mck has joined #aria-apg
18:04:40 [annabbott]
present+ AnnAbbott
18:04:48 [LJWatson]
rrsagent, make minutes
18:04:48 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/11/09-aria-apg-minutes.html LJWatson
18:04:57 [LJWatson]
rrsagent, set logs world-visible
18:04:57 [mck]
Present+ matt_king
18:05:02 [LJWatson]
rrsagent, make minutes
18:05:02 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/11/09-aria-apg-minutes.html LJWatson
18:05:38 [mck]
zakim, clear agenda
18:05:38 [Zakim]
agenda cleared
18:08:18 [IanPouncey1]
Present+ IanPouncey
18:08:23 [jongund]
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18:09:48 [Jemma_Ku]
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18:09:57 [jongund]
present+ jongund
18:10:44 [jongund]
rrsagent present+ jongund
18:11:36 [bgaraventa1979]
bgaraventa1979 has joined #aria-apg
18:11:40 [Jemma_Ku]
present+ jemmaku
18:11:48 [mck]
Agenda+ Pattern work status page update https://github.com/w3c/aria/wiki/Aria-Authoring-Practices-Patterns-Status
18:11:50 [mck]
Agenda+ Example template and example coding practices update
18:11:51 [mck]
Agenda+ Landmark navigation pattern review https://rawgit.com/w3c/aria/master/practices/aria-practices.html#landmarks
18:12:05 [jongund]
rrsagent present
18:12:08 [bgaraventa1979]
present+ Bryan_Garaventa
18:15:11 [annabbott]
scribe: AnnAbbott
18:15:56 [annabbott]
zakim, take up agenda item 1
18:15:56 [Zakim]
'item\ 1' does not match any agenda item, annabbott
18:16:15 [annabbott]
zakim, next agenda item
18:16:15 [Zakim]
I see a speaker queue remaining and respectfully decline to close this agendum, annabbott
18:16:24 [mck]
q?
18:16:37 [MichielBijl]
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18:16:37 [mck]
ack Jemma
18:16:41 [mck]
q?
18:16:55 [mck]
zakim, take up next agenda item
18:16:55 [Zakim]
agendum 1. "Pattern work status page update https://github.com/w3c/aria/wiki/Aria-Authoring-Practices-Patterns-Status" taken up [from mck]
18:16:57 [MichielBijl]
RRSAgent, makeminutes
18:16:57 [RRSAgent]
I'm logging. I don't understand 'makeminutes', MichielBijl. Try /msg RRSAgent help
18:17:01 [MichielBijl]
RRSAgent, make minutes
18:17:01 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/11/09-aria-apg-minutes.html MichielBijl
18:17:18 [MichielBijl]
present+ Michiel_Bijl
18:19:03 [annabbott]
Matt - none to tick off
18:19:31 [MichielBijl]
present- Matt King matt_king
18:19:36 [MichielBijl]
present+ Matt_King
18:19:43 [annabbott]
Jemma: done with checkbox 3 example
18:19:59 [annabbott]
Jon: waiting for it to be integrated into trunk
18:20:55 [Jemma_Ku]
this is pull request https://github.com/a11ydoer/aria/commit/1c4d8fcbde1624c6b12d9272873e937e34f
18:22:30 [Jemma_Ku]
https://cdn.rawgit.com/a11ydoer/practices/master/examples/checkbox/checkbox-3.html\
18:22:33 [Jemma_Ku]
https://cdn.rawgit.com/a11ydoer/practices/master/examples/checkbox/checkbox-3.html
18:23:34 [annabbott]
Matt: example 3 is mixed state checkbox
18:23:58 [mck]
Typo in following:
18:24:01 [mck]
• Changing the state of the standard checkboxes will update the state fo the ARIA mixed checkbox.
18:27:31 [annabbott]
Matt: NVDA doesn't read the individual labels, only the grouping label
18:27:49 [annabbott]
when tabbing
18:27:50 [jemma]
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18:28:02 [jemma]
sorry my pc died.
18:28:10 [jemma]
relogging in
18:28:54 [annabbott]
Matt: JAWS reads grouping label first when arrowing followed by individual label
18:30:14 [annabbott]
Matt: tabbing or X (special key) JAWS reads individual label followed by grouping label
18:30:52 [annabbott]
Jon: ID refs are not in source code
18:31:15 [jemmaku]
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18:32:14 [Birkir]
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18:32:19 [annabbott]
Jon: should spell out ID refs
18:33:48 [annabbott]
Jon: should not provide multiple labeling techniques
18:34:48 [Birkir]
condaments taste better when they are in a fieldset.
18:37:32 [Birkir]
Should we run the code through the html5 validator?
18:42:33 [annabbott]
Jon: should be careful if HTML spec isn't final yet
18:44:53 [MichielBijl]
scribe: MichielBijl
18:46:07 [annabbott]
ok Michiel!
18:46:19 [MichielBijl]
bgaraventa1979: I'm for the aria solutions, because we can point people at one spec.
18:46:30 [MichielBijl]
mck: so not the fieldset idea?
18:46:35 [MichielBijl]
bgaraventa1979: yeah for now
18:47:11 [MichielBijl]
IanPouncey: I'm fine with that, if it's good enough.
18:48:37 [MichielBijl]
Jon: what does the ARIA 5.1 spec say?
18:48:48 [MichielBijl]
mck: you mean what it says in the mapping guide?
18:49:01 [MichielBijl]
jongund: how stable is that document?
18:49:22 [LJWatson]
HTML5.1 ARIA: http://www.w3.org/TR/html-aria/
18:49:28 [MichielBijl]
mck: I don't know, exspect it as we go through there would be adjustments
18:49:36 [MichielBijl]
jongund: I meant fundamental changes
18:50:43 [MichielBijl]
LJWatson: what are we looking for in the mapping that would mix things up?
18:51:04 [MichielBijl]
LJWatson: the a11y name calculation looks at the a11y tree
18:51:23 [MichielBijl]
mck: there is nothing that says it would be dependent on the content
18:53:44 [jongund]
http://www.w3.org/TR/html-aam-1.0/
18:55:02 [jongund]
http://www.w3.org/TR/accname-aam-1.1/
18:56:47 [LJWatson]
HTML checked state test cases http://ljwatson.github.io/test-cases/checked-state/case.html
19:01:15 [MichielBijl]
mck: you're saying that in firefox the mixed state is not supported at all?
19:01:25 [MichielBijl]
mck: native windows checkboxes do
19:01:44 [MichielBijl]
mck: let's make a descission
19:02:08 [MichielBijl]
mck: our initial goal was to show aria usage
19:02:21 [MichielBijl]
mck: we have three examples that are all aria
19:03:02 [MichielBijl]
mck: the only thing that got us in this discussion was the labeling technique
19:03:22 [MichielBijl]
mck: like the idea to use fieldset and legend for the labelling technique
19:03:43 [MichielBijl]
mck: with minimal amount of aria scripting
19:03:57 [MichielBijl]
mck: and still get their three state checkbox
19:04:38 [MichielBijl]
mck: any objections?
19:04:51 [MichielBijl]
mck: no objection, jemma can you make the change?
19:10:34 [jongund]
I have to go
19:11:44 [Birkir]
In ARIA 1.0 aria-checked is actually not allowed on the checkbox role, this was fixed in ARIA 1.1, one of my favorite oddities.
19:12:13 [Birkir]
html label applied to a simulated form field sod not appear to work, at least with Jaws in IE/FF,
19:12:48 [Birkir]
This code does not announce as expected (Jaws guesses label from nearest paragraph, not fromt he associated label): <label for="ch1">Are you able to vote?</label> <p>Are you a man or a mouse?</p> <span role="checkbox" aria-checked="false" id="ch1"></span>
19:13:31 [MichielBijl]
http://dir.agosto.nl/accessibility/examples/Alert/index.html
19:13:51 [MichielBijl]
mck: Michiel you had an alert example?
19:13:56 [MichielBijl]
MichielBijl: correct
19:14:21 [MichielBijl]
MichielBijl: it shows an alert after two seconds
19:22:21 [jemma]
this is the link to example.js file which outputs html code to the template page.
19:22:22 [jemma]
https://github.com/a11ydoer/practices/blob/master/examples/js/examples.js
19:28:29 [jemma]
https://github.com/a11ydoer/aria/blob/master/practices/examples/js/examples.js
19:28:40 [MichielBijl]
Here is the alert example PR: https://github.com/w3c/aria/pull/105
19:29:38 [jemma]
https://github.com/w3c/aria/tree/master/practices/examples/js
19:34:01 [MichielBijl]
https://github.com/w3c/aria/pull/98
19:35:20 [MichielBijl]
안녕하세요
19:35:47 [jemma]
안녕
19:37:02 [LJWatson]
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19:37:07 [MichielBijl]
RRSAgent, make minutes
19:37:07 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/11/09-aria-apg-minutes.html MichielBijl
19:38:39 [MichielBijl]
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