See also: IRC log
<trackbot> Date: 23 September 2015
<kerry> scribe: frans
<kerry> scribenick: frans
<jonblower> [apologies, slightly distracted today, trying to multitask on an urgent issue!]
<scribe> chair: kerry
<kerry> http://www.w3.org/2015/09/16-sdw-minutes.html
<kerry> +1
<eparsons> +1
<jtandy> +1
<Linda> +1
<Alejandro_Llaves> +1
<Payam> +1
<MattPerry> +1
proposed: approve last meetings minutes
resolved: minutes accepted
<kerry> https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/wiki/Patent_Call
kerry: we have lost Lewis as a BP
editor
... two editors are present: jtandy and payam
<kerry> https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/wiki/BP_Consolidated_Narratives#linking_data
kerry hands over to jtandy
<jtandy> https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/wiki/Linking_Data#Best_Practice_theme:_Linking_Data
<jtandy> https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/wiki/Linking_Data
jtandy: made a page with
questions about linking spatial data
... related to the ´identifier´ and ´semantics´ themes
... would be happy if other people contribute to the wiki
page
<eparsons> +1
<Linda> +1
<billroberts> +1
<kerry> +1
frans: are HTML pages with embedded data considered structured data?
jtandy: yes, the embedded data are structured data
ed: agrees, challenge is to make implicit data on html pages explicit
<kerry> +1
jtandy: letś encourage best
practices regardless of data format
... Where do links commonly occur?
... please add more items to the list
kerry: please identify who you are when you add to the wiki page
<jtandy> [jtandy]
jtandy: we could use prefixes (if you are not jtandy)
<Zakim> kerry, you wanted to ask about how to do this
links also commonly occur in metadata
<billroberts> I need to mull it over but will add thoughts to the wiki - thanks jeremy
<kerry> https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/wiki/BP_Consolidated_Narratives#linking_data for lars -- we are here
subtopic: what should I link to?
jonblower: things could end up
having two IDs
... clarifying the difference between both types of resources
would be helpful
eparsons: likes to reinforces Jon´s point, the thing itself is more important than its spatial representation
<kerry> +1 to ed
kerry: identifiers is a different topic, so we need links between these two topics
jtandy agrees
jtandy: how do you link to things that do not have a URI?
eparsons hopes an answer is not expected
jon: do not have a answer but notes that hashtags can be made by the public and used as indentifiers
??: blank nodes could be used
<jonblower> (maybe I should say used for a similar role as identifiers. I didn't mean that hashtags are proper identifiers by themsleves. Just an example that the community will create these "anchors" if they don't exist)
LarsG: hashtags are not good as
identifiers. They are not specific enough
... they do not uniquely identify places
kerry: firstly: twitters hashtags
are a bad idea because they are not persistent
... secondly: why not create a new ID if you are unable to find
an exsiting one?
jtandy: people sometimes are too lazy to find existing IDs
eparsons: much data are powered by wikidata. So why not contribute to the source wiki?
jtandy: lalalala
jon: there is a big community that use hashtags to link things. It is not a good practice, but it is happening.
<eparsons> Agree with Jon we need to acknowledge the community in developing links
jon: we need to be aware that not all practices can be top down
aharth: describes a dataset where blank nodes are used to group data, with possibilty of improvement later
billroberts: best practices
should be realistic, describe ways of working with non ideal
data.
... unprecise data are still valuable.
jtandy agrees
<aharth> aharth: i'd suggest to look at schema.org for inspiration re linking without identifiers
<eparsons> +1 to schema.org
<jonblower> imprecise != not useful
jtandy: we should work with real world content and encourage better practices
subtopic: what do links mean?
jtandy: please add your thoughts to the wiki and add your name
subtopic: How can I describe
links in my format of choice?
... What else links to my subject of interest?
billroberts: reference area is
often a dimension in data cubes
... it works with one or a few SPARQL endpoints
... but on the full web it becomes difficult
... catalogs could be part of the solution.
<jonblower> (Sorry, got to go now, but referencing a conversation from earlier in the call, I was trying to articulate the difference between Spatial Objects and Spatial Things, as described in https://data.gov.uk/sites/default/files/Designing_URI_Sets_for_Location-V1.0_10.pdf. These were the "two identifiers for the same thing" that I was trying to explain.)
eparsons: public catalog of
places and relations between places can be useful
... but we need to accept that there are risks and complexities
when working with spatial references in statistical data
subtopic: How can I manage links between sets of things (so that I don't have to manage individual links)?
jtandy: how can we make this easier?
subtopic: How can third parties assert links and relationships (and should I trust their assertions?)
jtandy: how valid or trustworthy are spatial assertions on the web?
eparsons: how can we can keep this discussion going?
<eparsons> +1
jtandy: we could make an e-mail thread for each subtopic
esparsons: likes the idea
<Alejandro_Llaves> +1
linda: nice work by jtandy
... but we have to keep things in scope (i.e. only spatial)
<kerry> recall invitation to pass generic thing to data on the web
jtandy: yes, at some point we have to cut off
<jtandy> https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/wiki/BP_Structure_Examples#Summary_points
jtandy: please read this page react
linda: the examples I added were provided by Simeon Nedkov
<kerry> ACTION: jtandy to create thread for each linking theme [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2015/09/23-sdw-minutes.html#action01]
<trackbot> Created ACTION-79 - Create thread for each linking theme [on Jeremy Tandy - due 2015-09-30].
<eparsons> +1
<Linda> +1
<scribe> ACTION: jtandy to create e-mail threads for each linking subtopic [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2015/09/23-sdw-minutes.html#action02]
<trackbot> Created ACTION-80 - Create e-mail threads for each linking subtopic [on Jeremy Tandy - due 2015-09-30].
<billroberts> +1 sounds like we have quite a bit of discussion to do, so email first then a wiki summary if we reach some consensus?
kerry: lost my IRC
... suggest to go back to old times (Australian summer)
eparsons: let us pick times that
work well for Asia and Europe
... Australia is part of Asia
kerry: will put the new times on the mailing list.
<kerry> http://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/fixedtime.html?msg=SDWWG+Call&iso=20150211T20&ah=1
<eparsons> bye all
<LarsG> bye, thx
kerry: closes the meeting
<Alejandro_Llaves> thanks, bye!
<billroberts> bye
<eparsons> thanks frans
<Payam> thanks, bye
my pleasure