See also: IRC log
<trackbot> Date: 25 August 2015
<clown> agenda: this
<scribe> scribe: joanie
JS: This came up at last
Thursday's ARIA meeting.
... I was asked to bring this topic up here.
... We need to go through the mapping document and find out
what's new, and what's changed since ARIA 1.0.
... It probably means changing the existing test cases and
adding new test cases.
... For now it's something we need to think about.
... I'll do a little bit for test harness introduction.
RS: One of the things we need to
decide.... Since ARIA 1.1 takes advantage of native host
language semantics, e.g. you do not need to put role="row" on a
TR, do we need to test this?
... It seems like we might want to have a joint test suite with
Steve.
JS: Michael had suggested that
for "just ARIA" we could possibly just go with divs and
spans.
... We also had HTML table-related elements to test for
role="presentation"
... A test case looks like:
<clown> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/testharness/testcases/edit?testsuite_id=1&testcase_id=131
JS: The URL (above) shows a test case.
CS: If we can get webdriver working, we can do automated testing.
JS: Even if we do automated
testing, we have to set these things up.
... Looking at the test case at the above URL, you need to have
a "testable statement" (reads from example)
... You also need expected result. This can be for all
platforms or on a per-platform basis.
... Finally, at the bottom, you have a test file.
... In this case it's an HTML file set up to verify the
testable statement.
... Verification might be automated or done manually.
... Somewhere that result is recorded as a pass/fail.
RS: We're going to have to create all the testable statements.
JS: Yes, in some cases we will need to create new ones; in some cases we'll need to find the old/existing ones.
RS: Cynthia, are we just going to test UIA?
CS: That is my intention.
RS: I would like to focus on the
platform(s) we want to target.
... Do we still have the MSAA + UIA Express entries in the
table?
JS: Yes.
... We could add a statement that the UIA Express column is
deprecated (or something to that effect). Or we could remove
that column.
RS: I am hoping the browser team will be responsive so we can get quick turn around.
CS: It will depend on the timeline.
RS: It won't be tomorrow. We have
to write the test cases.
... Some of this you know is already implemented for UIA,
correct?
CS: Yes, some of it is already
implemented.
... I want to also get automated testing working.
RS: That might need to wait for ARIA 2.0, right?
CS: It depends.
JS: What is the testing timeframe?
RS: We're supposed to be done with ARIA 1.1 the middle of next year.
JS: So testing starts this fall then?
RS: Correct.
CS: That timeline is one where I think I can get automation at least somewhat working.
RS: I was hoping to get ERT going
so they could help us with this. But that isn't
happening.
... So the message for ARIA 1.1 is that we're focusing on Edge;
not IE.
JS: Please get me a statement please, Cynthia.
CS: Give me an action.
<clown> ACTION: Cynthia to compose a statement regarding the "deprecation" of UIA Express mappings in the core-asm, referencing the ARIA 1.0 mapping spec. [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2015/08/25-aapi-irc]
<trackbot> Created ACTION-1706 - Compose a statement regarding the "deprecation" of uia express mappings in the core-asm, referencing the aria 1.0 mapping spec. [on Cynthia Shelly - due 2015-09-01].
<clown> action-1706?
<trackbot> action-1706 -- Cynthia Shelly to Compose a statement regarding the "deprecation" of uia express mappings in the core-asm, referencing the aria 1.0 mapping spec. -- due 2015-09-01 -- OPEN
<trackbot> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1706
JS: I suspect the same thing has to be done with SVG AAM and HTML AAM. Right?
RS: Yes, we'll have to do
that.
... And Digital Publishing.
JS: DPub is not in the same time frame though, right?
RS: Right. Same thing for Graphics.
JS: With regards to actually
making test cases, someone needs to go through the spec and
find out what's changed.
... Who wants to take that on?
RS: Michael?
CS: It depends on the timeline.
JS: Last time, Michael did the
first pass.
... I remember doing 100+ test files last time.
RS: We almost need to do a diff.
JS: There's a ChangeLog.
<clown> http://w3c.github.io/aria/core-aam/core-aam.html#changelog
CS: And we use github so we can
do a diff.
... I'll take on writing test cases for UIA.
(Group discusses specifics of ChangeLogs)
RS: This is a good start. It's
very high-level, e.g. mappings for switch.
... Do we have this for ARIA too?
JS: Yes.
... The ARIA 1.0 mapping guide didn't have a UIA column.
<clown> http://w3c.github.io/aria/aria/aria.html#changelog
<cyns> have to head ot another meeting
RS: I'm concerned that the spec may not have all changes we need to test itemized in a ChangeLog.
JS: So presumably Joanie will be involved with ATK/AT-SPI2.
RS: I can help with MSAA + IA2 stuff.
JS: I'll volunteer to review everyone's work.
RS: Last time, I wrote or rewrote something like 600 test cases.
JS: And we discovered that a number of the grid test cases were not really grids; but mere barebones tests.
RS: If we get Michael to do the first pass....
JS: And I expect we'll use the same test harness. Or will we use github?
RS: What does that mean, "use github"?
JS: Add test cases to the github repo (i.e. in a folder in that repo).?
RS: Is that the best way to go do it?
JD: The more open, the better.
JS: Could we add something to Thursday's agenda to discuss these things with Michael?
RS: He's on Geek Week.
JS: I'll try to touch base with him.
<clown> action-1547?
<trackbot> action-1547 -- Richard Schwerdtfeger to Update test test cases involving rowgroup to ensure they are included within a grid container and to ensure that the expected result matches the new mappings -- due 2015-08-19 -- OPEN
<trackbot> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1547
JS: This came due last week.
RS: I've not done anything on test cases yet.
JS: We're still waiting on a resolution from Apple on this.
<clown> http://rawgit.com/w3c/aria/master/core-aam/core-aam.html#role-map-rowgroup
JS: The rest of the platforms have a mapping for this because the rowgroup could get focus and needs to be mapped.
<clown> issue-635?
<trackbot> issue-635 -- Determine if uaig mappings for rowgroup are correct -- open
<trackbot> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/issues/635
<clown> https://bugs.webkit.org/show_bug.cgi?id=146239#c2
JS: His latest comment on the
above bug is asking Chris Fleizach.
... Actually comment 6 seems to be implying that if an author
creates an interactive rowgroup, as far as Apple is concerns,
it's no longer a table.
... I think there's something on Thursday's agenda about this,
though I might be wrong.
... Action-1578 is on the agenda.
action-1578
<trackbot> action-1578 -- Richard Schwerdtfeger to Discuss issue-700 in aria task force meeting. -- due 2015-08-27 -- OPEN
<trackbot> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1578
issue-700
<trackbot> issue-700 -- Discuss rowgroup, tbody, and thead in aapis -- open
<trackbot> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/issues/700
RS: I thought we had already discussed this issue here (at this meeting)
JS: Correct. The only holdout is Apple.
RS: I thought we'd already
brought this to the ARIA task force.
... Who needs to reach out to James on this?
JS: I may not be at Thursday's meeting.
RS: You could reach out on the list.
JD: Looking at the bug's comment #6, we need to find out if such a table should not be mapped as a table for OS X.
<clown> http://w3c.github.io/aria/core-aam/core-aam.html#role-map-presentation
JS: (Reads from above mapping table)
RS: Joanie, can you verify what the functional/real mapping is for OS X for table with role="presentation"? I don't think what's in the mapping table accurately reflects what is happening.
JD: I'll add it to my list.
<clown> ACTION: Joseph to edit the AXAPI mapping table for roles presentation and none to specify that when applied to tables and lists, the children are exposed as AXStaticText accessible. [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2015/08/25-aapi-irc]
<trackbot> Created ACTION-1707 - Edit the axapi mapping table for roles presentation and none to specify that when applied to tables and lists, the children are exposed as axstatictext accessible. [on Joseph Scheuhammer - due 2015-09-01].
<clown> action-1707?
<trackbot> action-1707 -- Joseph Scheuhammer to Edit the axapi mapping table for roles presentation and none to specify that when applied to tables and lists, the children are exposed as axstatictext accessible. -- due 2015-09-01 -- OPEN
<trackbot> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1707
JD: Ok, I commented on https://bugs.webkit.org/show_bug.cgi?id=146239. Let's see what they say.
This is scribe.perl Revision: 1.140 of Date: 2014-11-06 18:16:30 Check for newer version at http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/ Guessing input format: RRSAgent_Text_Format (score 1.00) Succeeded: s/in that repo)./in that repo).?/ Found embedded ScribeOptions: -final *** RESTARTING DUE TO EMBEDDED OPTIONS *** Found Scribe: joanie Inferring ScribeNick: joanie Present: Joseph_Scheuhammer Joanmarie_Diggs Cynthia_Shelly Bryan_Garaventa Rich_Schwerdtfeger Found Date: 25 Aug 2015 People with action items: cynthia joseph WARNING: Input appears to use implicit continuation lines. You may need the "-implicitContinuations" option.[End of scribe.perl diagnostic output]