W3C

- DRAFT -

Web Content Accessibility Guidelines Working Group Teleconference

01 Apr 2014

See also: IRC log

Attendees

Present
Bruce_Bailey, Joshue, +1.479.772.aaaa, +1.910.278.aabb, kathleen, wilhelm, Sailesh_Panchang, Jon_avila, MartijnHoutepen
Regrets
Chair
Joshue
Scribe
bbailey

Contents


<trackbot> Date: 01 April 2014

<Joshue> >

scribe bbailey

<scribe> scribe: bbailey

<Joshue> Scribenick: bbailey

Publications Update

Joshue: we are trying to keep up 6 month schedule

<scribe> New techniques will need to be completed by May to meet this.

New survey of draft responses to comments https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/35422/1stApril2014/

ITEM: 1. Comment LC-2906: Draft response

<Joshue> LC-2906: Technique F24 promotes non-existing "color" attribute of body in example #2 (#16)

<Joshue> LC-2906: Technique F24 promotes non-existing "color" attribute of body in example #2 (#16)

https://www.w3.org/2006/02/lc-comments-tracker/35422/WD-WCAG20-TECHS-20140107/2906

Joshue: Read, paraphrase Jon A's response

Jon A; Had comments on his proposed response

Issue is that cannot set only one of foreground or background

Discuss that author cannot set only one of foreground or background

Implicit assumption is that user is not using UA color settings

<Joshue> +q

Concern is that user might have set preference for white on black instead of black on white

Concern with deprecated code snippets

Testability of techniques is a concern

Proposal is to reorder technique to address commenter concerns

Jon: Reorder will make technique clearer
... Some writing may be based on old browser behavior

Example, behavior of in-line CSS has changed over time

Question if rearranging proposed response requires particular response

Joshue: Propose additional action item to Jon

Concern that description also needs to be updated with proposed rewrite

<Joshue> http://www.w3.org/TR/WCAG-TECHS/F24.html

<scribe> ACTION: Jon_A review F24 [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2014/04/01-wai-wcag-minutes.html#action01]

<trackbot> Error finding 'Jon_A'. You can review and register nicknames at <http://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/track/users>.

<scribe> ACTION: Jac_avila to review F24 [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2014/04/01-wai-wcag-minutes.html#action02]

<trackbot> Error finding 'Jac_avila'. You can review and register nicknames at <http://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/track/users>.

<scribe> ACTION: Jon_avila to review F24 [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2014/04/01-wai-wcag-minutes.html#action03]

<trackbot> Error finding 'Jon_avila'. You can review and register nicknames at <http://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/track/users>.

<scribe> ACTION: avila to reve F24 [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2014/04/01-wai-wcag-minutes.html#action04]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-248 - Reve f24 [on Jonathan Avila - due 2014-04-08].

<Joshue> ACTION: Joshue to update technique F24 as proposed [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2014/04/01-wai-wcag-minutes.html#action05]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-249 - Update technique f24 as proposed [on Joshue O Connor - due 2014-04-08].

RESOLUTION: Accept LC-2906 as proposed

<Joshue> LC-2910: Avoid saying colour contrast https://www.w3.org/2006/02/lc-comments-tracker/35422/NOTE-UNDERSTANDING-WCAG20-20140306/2910

ITEM: 2. Comment LC-2910: Draft response

Joshue: Summarize that most developers think "colour/color contrast"

Technically, it actually luminance or hue contrast

Joshue: Survey response is to just use “contrast”

But this means we need to keep open, because it is a large editorial review

Kathleen: Contrast is often really scoped to television type display, not HMTL contrast

David: suggest just using “contrast ratio” per WCAG language

<Joshue> http://www.w3.org/TR/2008/WD-UNDERSTANDING-WCAG20-20080430/visual-audio-contrast-contrast.html

<kathleen> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Contrast_ratio

David asserts we don’t use “color contrast” in techniques

Group reviews understanding doc

<Joshue> http://www.w3.org/TR/UNDERSTANDING-WCAG20/visual-audio-contrast-contrast.html

Editorial review may be not be too much work since not much actual use of phrase

Links from understanding reference “color contrast”

Kathleen: Google hits for contrast ratio are on devices

<jon_avila> if you type web contrast ratio the expected items appear in Google.

Joshue: web developers think text colors

<Joshue> BB: Kathleen mentioned the physical devices, there is also the print world, and they call it colour contrast.

Loretta: reminds us that gregg was lead in being very careful with terminology

Discussion that WCAG original writing was very deliberate with phrasing

<jon_avila> f73 talks this it in detail.

Joshue that “color” is poorly defined in vernacular

Jon: F73 discusses color and hue

<Joshue> ACTION: Joshue to change reference to color contrast to contrast ratio [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2014/04/01-wai-wcag-minutes.html#action06]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-250 - Change reference to color contrast to contrast ratio [on Joshue O Connor - due 2014-04-08].

RESOLUTION: Accept LC-2910 as proposed

ITEM: 3. Comment LC-2891: Draft response

https://www.w3.org/2006/02/lc-comments-tracker/35422/WD-WCAG20-TECHS-20140107/2891

<Joshue> LC-2891: The technique doesn't solve the problem of the success criterion SCR21

<Joshue> https://www.w3.org/2006/02/lc-comments-tracker/35422/WD-WCAG20-TECHS-20140107/2891

Joshue: General response is to leave open

Loretta: This does seem like another case where we may need to revisit the test procedure and rewrite.
... Bug filed by Wilco when reviewing test procedure

Wilco: innerHTML used to be more problematic
... Purpose of technique is not clear

Loretta: Technique may be more of a suggestion or best practice

Joshue: Technique is valuable, but context needs work

Joshue asks if technique might be expanded?

<Wilco> +q

<Joshue> http://www.w3.org/TR/WCAG20-TECHS/SCR21

David suggest that technique was too easily interpreted (Gov of Canada) as a failure

Wilco: Technique seems better associated with 1.3.1

James: Technique really applicable to *any* generation of HTML

Joshue: Maybe need list of good/bad authoring techniques, then report back

<Wilco> +q

James raises question of how to fit script generation of content into WCAG

Wilco: This technique (SCR21) is applicable to many success criteria

Sailesh: Technique is targeted to 1.3.1

Joshue looking for volunteers to review scripting generally

<Joshue> https://www.w3.org/2006/02/lc-comments-tracker/35422/WD-WCAG20-TECHS-20140107/2891

<Wilco> +1

RESOLUTION: Accept LC-2891 as proposed

Joashue: Accessible scripting very important foundational topic

update on https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/wiki/Comments_Needing_Responses

Joshue: check on work status

<Joshue> https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/wiki/Comments_Needing_Responses

bbailey: can change listing page to link to work in wiki in progress

kathleen: question about process, submitted draft response

MichaelC: After submit, you should email editors

Also need to change status in comment tracker

review of David MacDs http://davidmacd.com/WCAG/wcag-html5-techniques-review.html

<Joshue> http://davidmacd.com/WCAG/wcag-html5-techniques-review.html

David: Summarizes table
... Did a pass, reviewing if caveats needed for HTML 5
... If no comments, techniques directly applicable as-is to HTML 5
... If no note, works as-is

<Joshue> https://www.w3.org/2006/02/lc-comments-tracker/35422/NOTE-UNDERSTANDING-WCAG20-20140306/2910

Touching back on LC-2910

Loretta: Caution that we should compete edits before responding to commenter

There may be grammar or other minor edits.

<jon_avila> I have to jump off the call. Have a great day!

Will not close until drafting complete on two items

David thinks its only one line in 1.4.3

<Joshue> ACTION: Josh to review instances of colour contrast usage and then reply to EO [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2014/04/01-wai-wcag-minutes.html#action07]

<trackbot> Created ACTION-251 - Review instances of colour contrast usage and then reply to eo [on Joshue O Connor - due 2014-04-08].

RESOLUTION: Leave LC-2910 open

Back to review of David’s summary table

David: Just 15 out of 59 need review

David many techniques back to 1999 HTML 4.0 but work fine in 5

David: Looking for ones that could cause trouble for 5
... HTML 5 broke very little backward compatibility

Joshue solicits for additional review

James: Would like ability to comment row-by-row

Joshue asks david to port to wiki

https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/wiki/

https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/wiki/

James: Will need cross reference to HTML 5 techniques too

https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/wiki/Working_Group_Techniques_Development_Assignments

Discussion of clarifying workflow

David: Asking for suggestion on formatting and presentation

<Zakim> Bruce_Bailey, you wanted to check that wiki cannot take HTML as input

MichaelC: For table, have use wki markup

Update on Techniques progress https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/wiki/Working_Group_Techniques_Development_Assignments

<wilhelm> http://wja.no/t/responsive-technique/

Joshue: Checks in with Sailesh, Wilco, Wilhelm

<Joshue> https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/wiki/Technique_Template

Wilhelm: Has proof of concept for 1 / 2 / 3 column responsive design

<Joshue> https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/wiki/Writing_WCAG_Techniques_-_Notes

Joshue reminds folks of URLs for template and instructions

Joshue: Looking for additional volunteers on techniques

RRS: Make Minutes

Summary of Action Items

[NEW] ACTION: avila to reve F24 [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2014/04/01-wai-wcag-minutes.html#action04]
[NEW] ACTION: Jac_avila to review F24 [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2014/04/01-wai-wcag-minutes.html#action02]
[NEW] ACTION: Jon_A review F24 [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2014/04/01-wai-wcag-minutes.html#action01]
[NEW] ACTION: Jon_avila to review F24 [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2014/04/01-wai-wcag-minutes.html#action03]
[NEW] ACTION: Josh to review instances of colour contrast usage and then reply to EO [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2014/04/01-wai-wcag-minutes.html#action07]
[NEW] ACTION: Joshue to change reference to color contrast to contrast ratio [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2014/04/01-wai-wcag-minutes.html#action06]
[NEW] ACTION: Joshue to update technique F24 as proposed [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2014/04/01-wai-wcag-minutes.html#action05]
 
[End of minutes]

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$Date: 2014-04-01 16:20:50 $

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Found Scribe: bbailey
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WARNING: Replacing list of attendees.
Old list: Bruce_Bailey Joshue +1.479.772.aaaa +1.910.278.aabb kathleen wilhelm Sailesh_Panchang Jon_avila MartijnHoutepen Michael_Cooper +1.650.214.aacc adam_solomon David_MacDonald Marc_Johlic James_Nurthen
New list: Bruce_Bailey Joshue +1.479.772.aaaa +1.910.278.aabb kathleen wilhelm Sailesh_Panchang Jon_avila MartijnHoutepen

Default Present: Bruce_Bailey, Joshue, +1.479.772.aaaa, +1.910.278.aabb, kathleen, wilhelm, Sailesh_Panchang, Jon_avila, MartijnHoutepen
Present: Bruce_Bailey Joshue +1.479.772.aaaa +1.910.278.aabb kathleen wilhelm Sailesh_Panchang Jon_avila MartijnHoutepen
Found Date: 01 Apr 2014
Guessing minutes URL: http://www.w3.org/2014/04/01-wai-wcag-minutes.html
People with action items: avila jac_avila jon_a jon_avila josh joshue

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