17:00:43 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #aapi
17:00:43 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2013/05/30-aapi-irc
17:00:45 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs member
17:00:45 <Zakim> Zakim has joined #aapi
17:00:47 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be WAI_PF
17:00:47 <Zakim> ok, trackbot; I see WAI_PFWG(AAPI)1:00PM scheduled to start now
17:00:48 <trackbot> Meeting: Protocols and Formats Working Group Teleconference
17:00:48 <trackbot> Date: 30 May 2013
17:01:03 <clown> rrsagent, make log public
17:02:00 <Zakim> WAI_PFWG(AAPI)1:00PM has now started
17:02:07 <Zakim> +[GVoice]
17:02:15 <clown> zakim, GVoice is Joseph_Scheuhammer
17:02:15 <Zakim> +Joseph_Scheuhammer; got it
17:02:24 <clown> zakim, I am Joseph_Scheuhammer
17:02:24 <Zakim> ok, clown, I now associate you with Joseph_Scheuhammer
17:03:17 <clown> chair:  Joseph_Scheuhammer
17:03:35 <clown> scribenick:  clown
17:04:17 <clown> agenda:  http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/wai-xtech/2013May/0009.html
17:05:02 <clown> previous:  http://www.w3.org/2013/05/16-aapi-minutes.html
17:05:15 <clown> rrsagent, make minutes
17:05:15 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2013/05/30-aapi-minutes.html clown
17:09:44 <Zakim> +[Microsoft]
17:10:15 <clown> zakim, Microsoft is Cynthia_Shelly
17:10:15 <Zakim> +Cynthia_Shelly; got it
17:11:32 <cyns> cyns has joined #aapi
17:12:37 <clown> Topic:  ACTION-1200
17:12:40 <clown> action-1200?
17:12:40 <trackbot> ACTION-1200 -- Cynthia Shelly to create table for author errors in UAIG, with columns for each API. -- due 2013-05-01 -- OPEN
17:12:40 <trackbot> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1200
17:12:59 <clown> CS:  Haven't done it, but on my to-do list.
17:13:26 <clown> JS:  let's change the due date.
17:14:06 <clown> CS:  let's set it to two weeks from now.
17:14:21 <clown> Topic:  ISSUE-550
17:14:26 <clown> issue-550?
17:14:26 <trackbot> ISSUE-550 -- Come up with a date to stop editing UAIG in preparation for the next Last Call Draft -- closed
17:14:26 <trackbot> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/issues/550
17:14:31 <clown> JS:  I have close this one.
17:14:40 <clown> s/close/closed/
17:14:56 <clown> topic:  ACTION-1221
17:15:01 <clown> action-1221?
17:15:01 <trackbot> ACTION-1221 -- Joseph Scheuhammer to for ISSUE-559, remove the text near the end of the section about ATK/AT-SPI about aria-atomic and member-of, and point to the aria-atomic='true' entry in the mapping table. -- due 2013-05-16 -- OPEN
17:15:01 <trackbot> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1221
17:16:06 <clown> JS:  I have discussed with David.
17:16:21 <clown> JS:  the best approach, we think, is to remove text from the AT-SPI section.
17:16:30 <clown> JS:  I will do that soon.
17:16:49 <clown> topic:  ACTION-1222
17:16:53 <clown> ACTION-1222?
17:16:53 <trackbot> ACTION-1222 -- David Bolter to look into ISSUE-583, and think about section 4.3, step 4A to see if that answers the question. -- due 2013-05-16 -- OPEN
17:16:53 <trackbot> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1222
17:17:00 <clown> JS:  David action, but he is not here.
17:17:24 <clown> topic:  remaining issues
17:17:30 <clown> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/products/10
17:17:48 <clown> agenda:  http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/wai-xtech/2013May/0009.html
17:18:48 <clown> issue-486?
17:18:48 <trackbot> ISSUE-486 -- UAIG has some MUST requirements that could only be tested in HTML 5, but 1) the ARIA spec is being tested only against HTML 4 and we prefer to do the same with UAIG, and 2) HTML 5 isn't complete; so we need to deal with this in the UAIG CR exit criteria n -- open
17:18:49 <trackbot> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/issues/486
17:19:38 <clown> JS:  text about mapping conflicts wrt html5 with some MUST statements.  These may have already been tested.
17:20:00 <clown> CS:  Yes, we are testing in modern browsers.
17:20:07 <clown> CS:  not sure this is an issue any more.
17:20:40 <clown> JS:  the tabindex information is now part of html5, so it may not even need to be their.
17:20:53 <clown> s/need to be their/need to be there/
17:21:20 <clown> CS: may be problematic to remove now.
17:21:56 <clown> action-1136?
17:21:56 <trackbot> ACTION-1136 -- Joseph Scheuhammer to ask the PFWG on the Mon call, what issue-486 is all about. -- due 2012-12-20 -- CLOSED
17:21:56 <trackbot> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1136
17:23:27 <clown> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/wai-xtech/2013May/0009.html
17:23:35 <clown> http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/aria-implementation/#mapping_additional_nd_te
17:26:47 <clown> CS:  can you check with Steve Faulkner?
17:27:08 <clown> CS:  what is the status of the html5 section 4.8.1.1?
17:27:46 <clown> CS:  he had written a separate document, and there is an issue if it belongs in the HTML5 spec, a separate document, owned by wcag, or something else.
17:28:19 <clown> JS:  are you referring to the editorial note?
17:28:52 <clown> CS:  yes, but also the box above since it references the section in the HTML5 spec (4.8.1.1) that the editorial note is talking about.
17:31:39 <clown> action-1142?
17:31:39 <trackbot> ACTION-1142 -- Joseph Scheuhammer to remove reference to HTML5 @alt section in the UAIG name calculation section. -- due 2013-02-01 -- CLOSED
17:31:39 <trackbot> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1142
17:33:14 <clown> topic:  551
17:33:17 <clown> issue-551?
17:33:17 <trackbot> ISSUE-551 -- When UAIG enters CR, we need to ask Director if we have to have 2 mappings to all platforms, or just demonstrate implementability of mapping via a sample and say all the mappings are therefore defined implementable -- open
17:33:17 <trackbot> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/issues/551
17:33:30 <clown> CS:  I think this is actually closed in that Michael asked Judy.
17:33:35 <clown> CS:  can you ask him on Mon?
17:33:38 <clown> JS:  yes.
17:33:49 <clown> action-1152?
17:33:49 <trackbot> ACTION-1152 -- Cynthia Shelly to investigate whether a pure UIA implementation does not have a description field -- due 2013-01-28 -- CLOSED
17:33:49 <trackbot> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1152
17:34:05 <clown> JS:  that on is closed.
17:34:33 <clown> s/that on is close/that one is closed/
17:35:51 <clown> topic:  issue-550
17:35:55 <clown> issue-550?
17:35:55 <trackbot> ISSUE-550 -- Come up with a date to stop editing UAIG in preparation for the next Last Call Draft -- closed
17:35:55 <trackbot> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/issues/550
17:36:15 <clown> JS:  whoops, that should be 560
17:36:20 <clown> topic: 560
17:36:27 <clown> issue-560?
17:36:27 <trackbot> ISSUE-560 -- MSAA/IA2 spec. inconsistent with implementation in FF on aria-activedescendant -- open
17:36:27 <trackbot> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/issues/560
17:36:38 <clown> JS:  that's a David issue, and he's not here.
17:37:06 <clown> JS  next is another FF question, skip it (issue-563).
17:37:22 <clown> topic: issue-564
17:37:25 <clown> issue-564?
17:37:25 <trackbot> ISSUE-564 -- ROLE_SYSTEM_TEXT is not used role="heading" -- open
17:37:25 <trackbot> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/issues/564
17:38:46 <clown> CS:  this is a case where FF is putting in strings where they should only put in enumerated types.
17:38:57 <clown> JS:  yes, david has another related issue, and this is going away.
17:39:19 <clown> JS:  it's action-1175
17:39:22 <clown> action-1175?
17:39:22 <trackbot> ACTION-1175 -- David Bolter to status of ROLE_SYSTEM_TEXT in MSAA/IA2 column for role=heading -- due 2013-03-18 -- OPEN
17:39:22 <trackbot> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1175
17:41:07 <clown> JS:  linking action 1175 to the issue to keep track of the work.
17:41:30 <clown> topic:  issue-566
17:41:35 <clown> issue-566?
17:41:35 <trackbot> ISSUE-566 -- Inconsistency between Spec's required states/properties for certain roles and UAIG's error handling of those roles/states/properties -- open
17:41:35 <trackbot> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/issues/566
17:42:12 <clown> JS:  your table for action-1200 will fix this.
17:42:30 <clown> JS:  and that action already associated with the issue.
17:43:46 <clown> JS:  there is an action on James Craig to change the spec for some of these,
17:43:55 <clown> CS:  Check with him about that on the mon call.
17:44:00 <clown> JS:  yes, good idea.
17:44:38 <clown> topic:  issue-570
17:44:44 <clown> issue-570?
17:44:44 <trackbot> ISSUE-570 -- Investigate if this UAIG requirement is incompatible with AX API. #keyboard-focus_aria-activedescendant "Do not expose the focused state in the accessibility API for any element when it has DOM focus and also has aria-activedescendant which points to a va -- open
17:44:45 <trackbot> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/issues/570
17:45:40 <clown> JS:  looks like an AXApi issue.
17:46:00 <clown> CS:  talk to James about this on Mon.
17:46:18 <clown> CS:  our position is to close this.  Do not want to open this can of worms again.
17:46:30 <clown> CS:  postpone to aria 2.0, perhaps.
17:47:24 <clown> topic:  issue-582
17:47:28 <clown> issue-582?
17:47:28 <trackbot> ISSUE-582 -- We don't have an explicit mapping, for each platform, for the focusable state in the UAIG -- open
17:47:28 <trackbot> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/issues/582
17:48:02 <clown> http://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/aria-implementation/#focus_state_event_table
17:48:16 <clown> JS:  James Craig suggested this is what rich was looking for.
17:48:23 <clown> CS:  works for me.
17:48:59 <clown> JS:  so, I'll point this out on Mon to, and see if we can close it.
17:49:31 <clown> topic:  583
17:49:36 <clown> Issue-583?
17:49:36 <trackbot> ISSUE-583 -- Elements that are descendants of an element having aria-activedescendant should not all be focusable -- open
17:49:36 <trackbot> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/issues/583
17:50:28 <clown> JS:  David had a suggestion — his action-1222
17:50:30 <clown> action-1222?
17:50:30 <trackbot> ACTION-1222 -- David Bolter to look into ISSUE-583, and think about section 4.3, step 4A to see if that answers the question. -- due 2013-05-16 -- OPEN
17:50:30 <trackbot> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1222
17:51:01 <clown> CS:  I think we should postpone this.
17:51:08 <clown> JS:  Aria 1.1 or 2.0?
17:51:43 <clown> CS:  2.0.  I could accept 1.1., but I think we should push this out to 2.0 since how OSes handle focus is revved much slower.
17:52:26 <clown> CS:  the core issue is that all issue should be postponed to 2.0 unless there is a real good reason to change things at this stage.
17:52:51 <clown> CS:  the bar is very high now.
17:53:35 <clown> topic:  issue-584
17:53:42 <clown> issue-584?
17:53:42 <trackbot> ISSUE-584 -- Firefox has introduce a role mapping of grouping for rowgroup (should this be consistent across platforms) -- open
17:53:42 <trackbot> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/issues/584
17:58:28 <clown> CS:  we shouldn't make the change, since this is testing implementabiity, and I think these tests have passed in older browsers.
17:58:52 <clown> JS: notes that this doesn't affect the UIA implementations.  Nor, probably, the Ax API implementation.
17:59:05 <clown> CS:  so, I vote for aria 1.1.
17:59:59 <Zakim> -Cynthia_Shelly
18:00:17 <clown> rrsagent, make minutes
18:00:17 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2013/05/30-aapi-minutes.html clown
18:01:28 <clown> regrets+ David_Bolter
18:01:47 <clown> zakim, please part
18:01:47 <Zakim> leaving.  As of this point the attendees were Joseph_Scheuhammer, Cynthia_Shelly
18:01:47 <Zakim> Zakim has left #aapi
18:01:57 <clown> rrsagent, make minutes
18:01:57 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2013/05/30-aapi-minutes.html clown
18:12:03 <clown> RRSAgent: please part
18:12:03 <RRSAgent> I see no action items