See also: IRC log
CS: talked to Larry
... DOM Level3 Events is better way to go
... DOM Level3 events are not specific to accessibility
... proposal seems to be gaining wide acceptance
... better approach than adding to ARIA
... rather than have event section in ARIA UAIG, should have
accessibility API in the DOM Level3 spec
... Cut event section from ARIA UAIG
DB: suppose a checkbox goes from checked to unchecked, the state changed event doesn't seem to be covered in James' document
CS: Section on events that each role should support is the one that should be removed
DB: still need the section on State and Property Changes
CS: DOM Level3 events ties the events to something else that developers want to do - seems like a better way to go
DB: agree
CS: Other discussion was about
actions
... Rich and I have had a lot of discussions about adding
something like UI patterns to WAI-ARIA
... UIA is a different approach - more of a "has a" approach
than a "is a" approach
... have a lot more UI things that are not exactly a menu or
button or whatever
... patterns are "invoke", "toggle", etc. - can combine
them
... AIA owns the UIA spec now. Rich participates. Good way to
get into it.
... rather than saying what MSAA default action every role
should support, makes more sense to invest in a future pattern
approach
... want to close these two bugs and pursue pattern based
approach for ARIA 2.0
... ATs must be simulating clicks now and it seems to work
DB: based on the role, we expose
actions, provide action name if the AT requests it
... DoDefault action sometimes simulates a mouse click
AS: table in 4.7 Actions that
lists the default action for ARIA roles that have actions
... Event column is blank
CS: remove the Event column
DB: Can leave the implementation to the browser
<scribe> ACTION: Cynthia to talk to Rich & Janina about a pattern based approach for ARIA 2.0 and will open the action item when appropriate. [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2010/10/28-aapi-minutes.html#action01]
http://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/buglist.cgi?product=ARIA
http://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/buglist.cgi?product=ARIA
bug 7223
add text to role table for "link"
bug 7634
http://www.w3.org/TR/2010/WD-wai-aria-implementation-20100916/#mapping_additional_nd
Cynthia checks to see what IE does
bug 9656
this is related to the aria-hidden issue
DB: case where somebody is
pointing to a label but the label is hidden
... don't really understand the author use case
... need to understand what this is critical for
... maybe this is the case where you want text that is hidden
except for screen readers
AS: isn't aria-label for that?
DB: maybe need to grab the
element using Ajax, translated version, don't want to hard code
the string?
... need test cases for aria-hidden to see what the browsers
are doing
... get explanations on why a certain way is better
... think this is the one that James felt pretty strongly
about
... Webkit will grab the text and include it in the text
alternative calculation
<scribe> ACTION: Cynthia to test what IE does for bug 7634 [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2010/10/28-aapi-minutes.html#action02]
<scribe> ACTION: Andi to draft text for 7223 [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2010/10/28-aapi-minutes.html#action03]
http://www.w3.org/TR/2010/WD-wai-aria-implementation-20100916/#mapping_actions
<scribe> ACTION: Cynthia to look at 7115 [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2010/10/28-aapi-minutes.html#action04]
DB: what does "cause actions to be associated with them" mean?
CS: maybe we can get rid of this table because we want to pursue a pattern based approach for ARIA 2.0
DB: think this kind of table might be more useful in a best practices guide
CS: delete the table
<scribe> ACTION: Andi to delete the table and close bug 7115 [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2010/10/28-aapi-minutes.html#action05]
CS and DB agree that changing the DOM because of ARIA is not the right approach
<scribe> ACTION: Andi to delete the Events column from the table of ARIA roles that have actions associated with them in section 4.7 Actions [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2010/10/28-aapi-minutes.html#action06]
This is scribe.perl Revision: 1.135 of Date: 2009/03/02 03:52:20 Check for newer version at http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/ Guessing input format: RRSAgent_Text_Format (score 1.00) Succeeded: s/passcode is 2274?// No ScribeNick specified. Guessing ScribeNick: Andi Inferring Scribes: Andi Default Present: Andi_Snow_Weaver, Cynthia_Shelley, David_Bolter, Tim_Boland Present: Andi_Snow_Weaver Cynthia_Shelley David_Bolter Tim_Boland WARNING: No meeting title found! You should specify the meeting title like this: <dbooth> Meeting: Weekly Baking Club Meeting Got date from IRC log name: 28 Oct 2010 Guessing minutes URL: http://www.w3.org/2010/10/28-aapi-minutes.html People with action items: andi cynthia WARNING: Input appears to use implicit continuation lines. You may need the "-implicitContinuations" option.[End of scribe.perl diagnostic output]