IRC log of dap on 2009-10-07
Timestamps are in UTC.
- 13:22:38 [RRSAgent]
- RRSAgent has joined #dap
- 13:22:38 [RRSAgent]
- logging to http://www.w3.org/2009/10/07-dap-irc
- 13:22:40 [trackbot]
- RRSAgent, make logs world
- 13:22:40 [Zakim]
- Zakim has joined #dap
- 13:22:42 [trackbot]
- Zakim, this will be DAP
- 13:22:42 [Zakim]
- ok, trackbot; I see UW_DAP()10:00AM scheduled to start in 38 minutes
- 13:22:43 [trackbot]
- Meeting: Device APIs and Policy Working Group Teleconference
- 13:22:43 [trackbot]
- Date: 07 October 2009
- 13:23:20 [fhirsch]
- Chair: Robin Berjon, Frederick Hirsch
- 13:24:01 [fhirsch]
- Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device-apis/2009Oct/0066.html
- 13:24:56 [fhirsch]
- fhirsch has changed the topic to: DAP Teleconference code 3279 Agenda http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device-apis/2009Oct/0066.html ; please enter attendance with Present+ first_last , also please tell zakim who you are with zakim, aaa is handle ; for the phone bridge
- 13:25:21 [fhirsch]
- Regrets: Dominique Hazaƫl-Massieux
- 13:27:42 [fhirsch]
- Regrets+ Marco_Marengo
- 13:31:37 [maxf_]
- Regrets+ maxf
- 13:36:08 [niklasw]
- niklasw has joined #dap
- 13:50:03 [AnssiK]
- AnssiK has joined #dap
- 13:54:14 [darobin]
- AnssiK, will you be joining the call today?
- 13:54:14 [Kangchan]
- Kangchan has joined #dap
- 13:55:25 [Zakim]
- UW_DAP()10:00AM has now started
- 13:55:32 [Zakim]
- +Kangchan
- 13:55:33 [Zakim]
- -Kangchan
- 13:55:34 [Zakim]
- UW_DAP()10:00AM has ended
- 13:55:34 [Zakim]
- Attendees were Kangchan
- 13:55:34 [Kangchan]
- Present+
- 13:56:01 [darobin]
- Kangchan: it's too early, the call starts in 5 minutes
- 13:56:15 [wonsuk]
- wonsuk has joined #dap
- 13:56:15 [Zakim]
- UW_DAP()10:00AM has now started
- 13:56:19 [Zakim]
- +ilkka
- 13:56:21 [Kangchan]
- Robin: Thanks..
- 13:56:22 [Zakim]
- +fjh
- 13:56:35 [darobin]
- and the correct syntax is "Present+ KangchanLee" :)
- 13:56:41 [ilkka]
- Present+ Ilkka_Oksanen
- 13:57:08 [Kangchan]
- Present+ Kangchan
- 13:57:26 [Zakim]
- +darobin
- 13:57:34 [darobin]
- Present+ Robin
- 13:57:39 [paddy]
- paddy has joined #dap
- 13:57:46 [dtran]
- dtran has joined #dap
- 13:58:07 [Zakim]
- +Kangchan
- 13:58:11 [dtran]
- Present+ Dzung_Tran
- 13:58:18 [Zakim]
- +wonsuk
- 13:58:23 [paddy]
- Present+ Paddy_Byers
- 13:58:26 [wonsuk]
- Present+ wonsuk
- 13:58:33 [Zakim]
- +AnssiK
- 13:59:04 [darobin]
- Victims list is: wonsuk, AnssiK, Mohammed, Daniel, Rob Ennals
- 13:59:17 [Zakim]
- +DzungTran
- 13:59:28 [AnssiK]
- Present+ AnssiK
- 14:00:06 [marcin]
- marcin has joined #dap
- 14:00:24 [niklasw]
- Present+ Niklas_Widell
- 14:00:41 [darobin]
- Zakim, who's making noise?
- 14:00:51 [Zakim]
- darobin, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: fjh (29%), darobin (39%), AnssiK (28%)
- 14:01:21 [marcin]
- Present+ Marcin_Hanclik
- 14:01:26 [Zakim]
- +JereK
- 14:01:29 [darobin]
- Scribe: Anssi Kostiainen
- 14:01:35 [darobin]
- ScribeNick: AnssiK
- 14:01:38 [cuihtlauac]
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- 14:01:38 [Zakim]
- +marcin2
- 14:01:46 [dtran]
- +dtran
- 14:01:52 [Laura_Arribas]
- Laura_Arribas has joined #dap
- 14:01:54 [JereK]
- JereK has joined #dap
- 14:01:59 [Zakim]
- + +04610715aaaa
- 14:02:02 [dtran]
- Present+ Dzung_Tran
- 14:02:04 [dtran]
- +dtran
- 14:02:04 [JereK]
- Present+ Jere_Kapyaho
- 14:02:08 [Zakim]
- +richt
- 14:02:13 [Laura_Arribas]
- Present+ Laura_Arribas
- 14:02:53 [AnssiK]
- TOPIC: Welcome
- 14:03:10 [richt]
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- 14:03:11 [Zakim]
- + +29605aabb
- 14:03:18 [drogersuk]
- drogersuk has joined #dap
- 14:03:19 [richt]
- Present+ Richard_Tibbett
- 14:03:21 [AnssiK]
- fh: everyone, please say "Present+ YourNick"
- 14:03:24 [Zakim]
- +LauraArribas
- 14:03:38 [Zakim]
- +??P32
- 14:03:39 [niklasw]
- zakim, +04610715aaaa is niklasw
- 14:03:39 [Zakim]
- +niklasw; got it
- 14:03:49 [fhirsch]
- TPAC registration and hotel reminder, registration until 23 October
- 14:03:50 [AnssiK]
- ... TPAC extended the lower registration fee period
- 14:04:10 [Claes]
- Claes has joined #dap
- 14:04:17 [AnssiK]
- ... there's also a dial-up questionnaire, please fill it in if you plan to call in to TPAC
- 14:04:47 [fhirsch]
- Mobile Web Application Best Practices
- 14:04:57 [fhirsch]
- http://www.w3.org/TR/2009/WD-mwabp-20091006/
- 14:05:08 [fhirsch]
- ask for reviewed
- 14:05:17 [darobin]
- ACTION: Robin to review MWABP
- 14:05:18 [trackbot]
- Created ACTION-26 - Review MWABP [on Robin Berjon - due 2009-10-14].
- 14:05:19 [AnssiK]
- ... the questionnaire is actually closed, so send an email to the members list instead
- 14:05:34 [Zakim]
- + +46.1.08.01.aacc - is perhaps Claes
- 14:05:49 [AnssiK]
- TOPIC: Minutes approval
- 14:06:02 [fhirsch]
- http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device-apis/2009Oct/0045.html
- 14:06:25 [AnssiK]
- fh: asking about minutes approval
- 14:06:33 [Claes]
- Present+ Claes_Nilsson
- 14:06:34 [cuihtlauac]
- cuihtlauac has joined #dap
- 14:07:12 [drogersuk]
- I am here, 'this passcode is not valid: 3279#' :-(
- 14:07:30 [Claes]
- zakim, Claes is handle
- 14:07:30 [Zakim]
- +handle; got it
- 14:08:20 [fhirsch]
- http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device-apis/2009Oct/0045.html
- 14:08:30 [fhirsch]
- RESOLUTION: Minutes from 30 Sept approved
- 14:08:40 [darobin]
- darobin has changed the topic to: DAP Teleconference code 3279 Agenda http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device-apis/2009Oct/0066.html ; please enter attendance with Present+ first_last , also please tell zakim who you are with zakim, aaa is $irc_nicname ; for the phone bridge
- 14:09:00 [Zakim]
- +??P1
- 14:09:16 [fhirsch]
- TOPIC: Policy Segment - API Identification
- 14:09:22 [drogersuk]
- I can hear you all now, thank you W3C office for letting me in!
- 14:09:46 [fhirsch]
- issue-26?
- 14:09:46 [trackbot]
- ISSUE-26 -- How to refer to API -- RAISED
- 14:09:46 [trackbot]
- http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/issues/26
- 14:10:29 [Claes]
- zakim, aaa is Claes
- 14:10:29 [Zakim]
- sorry, Claes, I do not recognize a party named 'aaa'
- 14:10:38 [marcin]
- q+
- 14:10:52 [tlr]
- zakim, call thomas-781
- 14:10:52 [Zakim]
- ok, tlr; the call is being made
- 14:10:54 [Zakim]
- +Thomas
- 14:10:55 [hendry]
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- 14:10:59 [AnssiK]
- fh: features, attributes, modules discussed in the context of Policy
- 14:11:05 [tlr]
- zakim, I am thomas
- 14:11:05 [Zakim]
- ok, tlr, I now associate you with Thomas
- 14:11:07 [tlr]
- zakim, mute me
- 14:11:07 [Zakim]
- Thomas should now be muted
- 14:11:41 [fhirsch]
- question of granularity of access control for APIs
- 14:12:00 [AnssiK]
- marcin: not sure if agrees on the granularity level
- 14:12:03 [fhirsch]
- do we agree on granularity at method level, or group of methods called a feature
- 14:12:12 [tlr]
- q+
- 14:12:17 [fhirsch]
- how to deal with modules as a whole
- 14:12:23 [AnssiK]
- margin: ... in BONDI we added attributes and constants under feature
- 14:12:30 [fhirsch]
- what is approach to attributes
- 14:12:31 [tlr]
- q+ to note that there are different security considerations for adding a contact or reading one
- 14:12:32 [fhirsch]
- q?
- 14:12:32 [AnssiK]
- s/margin/marcin/
- 14:12:37 [fhirsch]
- ack marcin
- 14:13:12 [fhirsch]
- ack Thomas
- 14:13:14 [Zakim]
- Thomas, you wanted to note that there are different security considerations for adding a contact or reading one
- 14:13:39 [fhirsch]
- note that we may want to raise issue for security related to events/callbacks
- 14:13:59 [brianleroux]
- brianleroux has joined #dap
- 14:14:04 [AnssiK]
- Thomas: question about an API that can access data storage
- 14:14:36 [tlr]
- the point is less about storage, but more about the distinct security considerations... This is an example.
- 14:14:41 [tlr]
- ack thom
- 14:14:42 [fhirsch]
- q+
- 14:14:53 [AnssiK]
- marcin: you can do everything on storage
- 14:15:04 [brianleroux]
- +Brian_LeRoux
- 14:15:22 [AnssiK]
- Thomas: for reading and writing or reading, depending on the UC I might have different security considerations
- 14:15:29 [tlr]
- thx
- 14:15:37 [brianleroux]
- ah, thx
- 14:15:44 [brianleroux]
- Present+ Brian_LeRoux
- 14:15:47 [AnssiK]
- marcin: current filesystem API from BONDI has filesystem.read and filesystem.write
- 14:16:13 [AnssiK]
- ... all methods and attributes are covered needed to read from the file
- 14:16:28 [Zakim]
- + +1.604.685.aadd
- 14:16:41 [AnssiK]
- ... CRUD mentioned
- 14:16:51 [AnssiK]
- ... as in Create, Read, Update, Delete
- 14:17:07 [fhirsch]
- anssi suggests that features need to be defined according to CRUD, one feature for each...
- 14:17:17 [AnssiK]
- ... we'll need a CRUD design pattern for all the APIs
- 14:17:21 [fhirsch]
- s/anssi/marcin
- 14:18:30 [niklasw]
- niklasw has joined #dap
- 14:19:17 [AnssiK]
- ... example: open, read and close methods
- 14:19:42 [AnssiK]
- ... reading UC: we should also cover the constants
- 14:20:06 [AnssiK]
- ... opening a file uses reading and writing?
- 14:20:30 [AnssiK]
- ... someone who has access to the file reading UC could open a file in a write mode and open would be succesful in write mode
- 14:20:54 [AnssiK]
- ... what happens if someone open the file in truncate mode
- 14:21:35 [AnssiK]
- s/open/opens/
- 14:21:39 [fhirsch]
- q?
- 14:21:43 [fhirsch]
- ack fhirsch
- 14:21:57 [AnssiK]
- fh: the issue with callbacks and events
- 14:22:44 [AnssiK]
- marcin: I don't know how it's expessed with a URI
- 14:23:46 [fhirsch]
- Marcin notes may not protect existing events, but restrict new events and handlers introduced in DAP
- 14:23:56 [AnssiK]
- ... events such as keypress discussed
- 14:24:00 [JereK]
- q+
- 14:24:09 [fhirsch]
- ack jerek
- 14:24:43 [AnssiK]
- JereK: if you are given access to a function, callbacks should be also allowed
- 14:25:02 [AnssiK]
- marcin: callbacks that are parameters to event listeners will be handled
- 14:25:18 [fhirsch]
- feature may include method plus input arg to be meaningful, eg file open with read or write input argument would correspond to different features
- 14:25:38 [tlr]
- declarative definition of handlers in mark-up
- 14:25:40 [tlr]
- input events
- 14:25:50 [AnssiK]
- ... handlers such as onkeypress
- 14:26:00 [fhirsch]
- input events - see email from David Rogers...
- 14:26:24 [AnssiK]
- ... handlers the concern, not the callbacks
- 14:26:29 [DanielColoma]
- DanielColoma has joined #dap
- 14:26:39 [AnssiK]
- fh: there's many ways code can be executed
- 14:27:04 [marcin]
- About features, possible principle: "protect information, not APIs that are behind it"
- 14:28:09 [AnssiK]
- fh: URIs seem to be a good approach, there seems to be a general agreement
- 14:28:14 [marcin]
- About events: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-webapps/2009OctDec/0069.html
- 14:28:16 [AnssiK]
- ... hierarchical use of features
- 14:28:26 [AnssiK]
- ... one API can invoke another API
- 14:29:00 [fhirsch]
- issue-27?
- 14:29:00 [trackbot]
- ISSUE-27 -- [Policy] Is revocation in scope -- RAISED
- 14:29:00 [trackbot]
- http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/issues/27
- 14:29:38 [Zakim]
- + +03491337aaee
- 14:29:50 [AnssiK]
- fh: do we want to discuss revocation?
- 14:30:09 [AnssiK]
- ... there are many mechanisms
- 14:30:30 [drogersuk]
- q+
- 14:30:36 [AnssiK]
- ... wants to raise the issue explicitly
- 14:30:40 [fhirsch]
- ack drogersuk
- 14:31:10 [JereK]
- charter, section 2.2: "The management of security policies ... is out of scope"
- 14:31:11 [fhirsch]
- management is out of charter scope, so I believe we should consider revocation out of scope
- 14:31:27 [AnssiK]
- drogersuk: kill switches discussed
- 14:31:38 [fhirsch]
- but I suggest we can consider authentication in scope
- 14:33:03 [AnssiK]
- ... we should leave the policy discussion to the end?
- 14:33:24 [AnssiK]
- ... do we have an e2e view re policy?
- 14:33:53 [drogersuk]
- I agree that the detail can be deferred, but we need to acknowledge it somewhere
- 14:33:58 [tlr]
- +1 to deferring
- 14:34:00 [drogersuk]
- in a policy overview doc or something
- 14:34:59 [drogersuk]
- so policy needs to come from somewhere and then go somewhere (good or bad) - e.g. removal / revocation / kill-switches / management
- 14:35:00 [AnssiK]
- fh: do the others have comments re deferring to v.next?
- 14:35:05 [JereK]
- +1 to defer
- 14:35:22 [paddy]
- +1 to more time
- 14:35:52 [wonsuk]
- +1 to defer
- 14:35:53 [drogersuk]
- I agree with Paddy
- 14:36:08 [drogersuk]
- we need to scope
- 14:36:31 [AnssiK]
- paddy: what's the scope for work were deferring?
- 14:36:52 [fhirsch]
- proposed resolution- defer specifying revocation mechanisms or expressing them until v.next
- 14:37:06 [AnssiK]
- s/were/we're/
- 14:37:54 [AnssiK]
- drogersuk: BONDI specifics discussed
- 14:38:24 [drogersuk]
- anssik: paddy
- 14:38:46 [AnssiK]
- s/drogersuk:/paddy:/
- 14:39:41 [tlr]
- fjh - agreement: 1. defer, 2. keep some hooks
- 14:39:47 [AnssiK]
- fh: paddy to provide a proposal for resolution
- 14:40:13 [AnssiK]
- fh: I raised another issue on the list based on position papers
- 14:40:47 [AnssiK]
- ... feedback given we should not be so strict
- 14:41:35 [DanielColoma]
- Zakim, +03491337aaee is DanielColoma
- 14:41:35 [Zakim]
- +DanielColoma; got it
- 14:41:40 [marcin]
- q+
- 14:41:44 [fhirsch]
- ack marcin
- 14:41:48 [AnssiK]
- ... Geolocation API is a bit different
- 14:42:12 [fhirsch]
- TOPIC: policy - use of model dialogs
- 14:42:15 [AnssiK]
- marcin: Geolocation spec not limited to dialogs
- 14:42:18 [fhirsch]
- issue-28?
- 14:42:18 [trackbot]
- ISSUE-28 -- [Policy] Requirement for NO security prompting -- RAISED
- 14:42:18 [trackbot]
- http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/issues/28
- 14:42:57 [tlr]
- q+ to speak to a scope point here
- 14:43:29 [fhirsch]
- ack thomas
- 14:43:29 [Zakim]
- Thomas, you wanted to speak to a scope point here
- 14:43:58 [AnssiK]
- Thomas: having too many conversation on security UIs
- 14:44:13 [AnssiK]
- ... non-modal UIs discussed
- 14:44:31 [AnssiK]
- ... we should not specify APIs which require modal dialogs
- 14:44:50 [AnssiK]
- ... modal dialogs are blocking
- 14:45:05 [fhirsch]
- q+
- 14:45:15 [marcin]
- +1 to non-blocking / asynchronous methods
- 14:45:21 [AnssiK]
- ... UA differences to be taken into consideration
- 14:45:24 [fhirsch]
- ack fhirsch
- 14:45:28 [tlr]
- zakim, mute me
- 14:45:28 [Zakim]
- Thomas should now be muted
- 14:45:53 [AnssiK]
- fh: easy out for security policy to use modal dialogs
- 14:46:10 [tlr]
- ack th
- 14:46:39 [tlr]
- zakim, mute me
- 14:46:39 [Zakim]
- Thomas should now be muted
- 14:46:51 [tlr]
- +1
- 14:47:45 [fhirsch]
- TOPIC: Policy action review
- 14:47:55 [fhirsch]
- action-15?
- 14:47:55 [trackbot]
- ACTION-15 -- Marcin Hanclik to review/compare device capabilities and features -- due 2009-09-30 -- OPEN
- 14:47:55 [trackbot]
- http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/actions/15
- 14:48:15 [fhirsch]
- action-15 closed
- 14:48:15 [trackbot]
- ACTION-15 Review/compare device capabilities and features closed
- 14:48:20 [AnssiK]
- marcin: sent an email re the action above
- 14:48:41 [fhirsch]
- action-23?
- 14:48:41 [trackbot]
- ACTION-23 -- Paddy Byers to open an issue and start a discussion on features/device capabilities -- due 2009-10-07 -- OPEN
- 14:48:41 [trackbot]
- http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/actions/23
- 14:48:43 [AnssiK]
- fh: capabilities and features under discussion
- 14:48:58 [AnssiK]
- paddy: will send an email to the list
- 14:49:23 [AnssiK]
- fh: any topics on policy I have missed?
- 14:49:38 [AnssiK]
- ... otherwise let's move on to APIs
- 14:49:41 [paddy]
- Scope excludes UA requirements relating to support for revocation, including support for specific certificate profiles, OSCP profiles, or any requirement to support certificate status/CRL checking.
- 14:49:49 [paddy]
- Scope includes ensuring there is provision within any formats or policy or trust model that may be necessary, under reasonably foreseeable use cases, to allow such requirements to be specified independently.
- 14:51:52 [AnssiK]
- RESOLUTION: Scope excludes UA requirements relating to support for revocation, including support for specific certificate profiles, OSCP profiles, or any requirement to support certificate status/CRL checking.
- 14:52:13 [AnssiK]
- RESOLUTION: Scope includes ensuring there is provision within any formats or policy or trust model that may be necessary, under reasonably foreseeable use cases, to allow such requirements to be specified independently.
- 14:52:22 [AnssiK]
- TOPIC: API Segment
- 14:52:30 [darobin]
- http://dev.w3.org/2009/dap/api-reqs/Overview.html
- 14:53:02 [AnssiK]
- darobin: please review the requirements so that we can publish it as a Note
- 14:53:12 [JereK]
- q+
- 14:53:20 [darobin]
- ack JereK
- 14:53:23 [fhirsch]
- q+
- 14:53:24 [AnssiK]
- ... Working Draft actually before a Note
- 14:53:40 [AnssiK]
- JereK: system information sensor access lumps sensors under sysinfo
- 14:53:47 [AnssiK]
- ... should those be split
- 14:53:53 [AnssiK]
- ... aka Sensor API
- 14:54:06 [AnssiK]
- darobin: what should be in the first version of the requirements document
- 14:54:16 [AnssiK]
- ... the 1st version we put out do not have to be perfect
- 14:54:47 [AnssiK]
- ... ok to push the document out with the sensor issue?
- 14:55:11 [paddy]
- +1 for dedicated extensible sensor API
- 14:56:00 [AnssiK]
- JereK: NFC mentioned
- 14:56:02 [drogersuk]
- NFC is a write and read transducer
- 14:56:11 [drogersuk]
- sensor and 'actuator'
- 14:56:18 [fhirsch]
- q?
- 14:56:36 [darobin]
- ack fhirsch
- 14:57:26 [tlr]
- ack thom
- 14:58:08 [AnssiK]
- Thomas: WD should be published ASAP
- 14:58:21 [Claes]
- +1 for extensible sensor API
- 14:58:28 [brianleroux]
- +1 to publish
- 14:58:29 [AnssiK]
- darobin: any concerns re fast publication?
- 14:58:41 [brianleroux]
- +1 for sensors
- 14:58:52 [AnssiK]
- fh: it would be valuable to get feedback, and publishing a WD is a good way to accomplish that
- 14:59:10 [fhirsch]
- q?
- 14:59:34 [AnssiK]
- RESOLUTION: publish a Working Draft of the Requirements document before TPAC
- 15:00:18 [fhirsch]
- q+
- 15:00:20 [AnssiK]
- darobin: proposing a doing quick actions review, if no specific issues
- 15:00:28 [Zakim]
- -Thomas
- 15:00:31 [fhirsch]
- q-
- 15:00:50 [brianleroux]
- hey, sorry my call dropped
- 15:00:52 [Zakim]
- - +1.604.685.aadd
- 15:00:54 [brianleroux]
- yes to file and camera
- 15:00:55 [fhirsch]
- action-19?
- 15:00:55 [trackbot]
- ACTION-19 -- Brian LeRoux to leroux to review contact, camera, file-system -- due 2009-09-30 -- OPEN
- 15:00:55 [trackbot]
- http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/actions/19
- 15:01:06 [AnssiK]
- ACTION-21?
- 15:01:06 [trackbot]
- ACTION-21 -- Bryan Sullivan to send comments about Arve's requirements for ISSUE-6 -- due 2009-09-30 -- OPEN
- 15:01:06 [trackbot]
- http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/actions/21
- 15:01:22 [fhirsch]
- q+
- 15:01:39 [AnssiK]
- darobin: AOB
- 15:01:46 [fhirsch]
- q-
- 15:02:23 [AnssiK]
- ... straw-poll on device object
- 15:02:34 [Zakim]
- + +1.604.685.aaff
- 15:02:44 [Zakim]
- - +1.604.685.aaff
- 15:02:52 [drogersuk]
- q+
- 15:03:46 [AnssiK]
- drogersuk: about Contacts API, are we taking Nokia, BONDI and PhoneGap inputs as is or start from the scratch
- 15:03:49 [Bryan]
- Bryan has joined #dap
- 15:03:58 [AnssiK]
- darobin: we're starting with requirements gathering
- 15:04:04 [Zakim]
- +Bryan_Sullivan
- 15:04:29 [AnssiK]
- ... the draft was to kick-start the work
- 15:04:31 [drogersuk]
- so it could be 'another' API to add to the mixx
- 15:04:49 [AnssiK]
- ... took parts from both Nokia and BONDI
- 15:05:03 [brianleroux]
- drogersuk: the more we look at the better / PhoneGap is an aggregate of all the mobile smartphones
- 15:05:28 [AnssiK]
- drogersuk: concerned on the length of time it'll take to produce the specs
- 15:05:33 [brianleroux]
- however, for example, I quite like googles contacts api for gmail, etc
- 15:05:43 [drogersuk]
- what about design patterns for example?
- 15:05:55 [AnssiK]
- darobin: we can start with existing inputs, but both have issues so it would not actually speed things up
- 15:06:32 [AnssiK]
- drogersuk: design patterns should provide the basis for all the APIs
- 15:06:46 [AnssiK]
- darobin: patterns easier to derive from concrete work
- 15:07:18 [AnssiK]
- drogersuk: we should draw from the experience from the inputs
- 15:07:51 [AnssiK]
- darobin: not sure how we're not using prior art to our advantage
- 15:08:26 [AnssiK]
- drogersuk: to dive into specific API and doing it again could end up in doing more work
- 15:08:48 [marcin]
- q+
- 15:08:56 [AnssiK]
- darobin: argument understood, not clear what is proposed to address it, publish patterns beforehand?
- 15:09:05 [darobin]
- ack drogersuk
- 15:09:13 [darobin]
- ack marcin
- 15:09:31 [AnssiK]
- marcin: re design patterns, in BONDI we have tried to identify the patterns
- 15:09:47 [AnssiK]
- ... similar document could be delivered to DAP
- 15:10:07 [Bryan]
- q+
- 15:10:19 [drogersuk]
- can we agree a clear strategy in terms of API design?
- 15:10:38 [darobin]
- ACTION: Marcin to provide a design patterns document before TPAC
- 15:10:38 [trackbot]
- Created ACTION-27 - Provide a design patterns document before TPAC [on Marcin Hanclik - due 2009-10-14].
- 15:12:23 [AnssiK]
- drogersuk: wants to see a strategy how we'll deliver the APIs instead adademic discussion on API design
- 15:14:01 [AnssiK]
- darobin: AOB
- 15:14:07 [darobin]
- ack Bryan
- 15:15:06 [AnssiK]
- Bryan: would like to see design patterns done fast, there's market momentum which would benefit us moving fast
- 15:15:18 [drogersuk]
- q+
- 15:15:26 [darobin]
- ack drogersuk
- 15:16:21 [AnssiK]
- drogersuk: looking at the inputs and conflicts in them
- 15:16:40 [AnssiK]
- darobin: we have three primary inputs, in some cases four
- 15:16:58 [richt]
- q
- 15:17:13 [AnssiK]
- ... it would be a bruising process if we start looking into inputs in details
- 15:17:32 [AnssiK]
- drogersuk: can we identify areas where we agree on
- 15:17:47 [AnssiK]
- darobin: beneficial approach for generic patterns
- 15:17:59 [drogersuk]
- in APIs too, not just the patterns
- 15:18:20 [AnssiK]
- ... we as a group don't want to do the same mistakes as what's potentially present in the input
- 15:19:03 [Zakim]
- -LauraArribas
- 15:19:03 [AnssiK]
- TOPIC: Adjourn
- 15:19:04 [Zakim]
- -Bryan_Sullivan
- 15:19:06 [Zakim]
- -DzungTran
- 15:19:06 [Zakim]
- -marcin2
- 15:19:07 [Zakim]
- -darobin
- 15:19:08 [Zakim]
- -richt
- 15:19:09 [Zakim]
- -Claes
- 15:19:10 [Zakim]
- -fjh
- 15:19:12 [Zakim]
- -niklasw
- 15:19:14 [Zakim]
- -ilkka
- 15:19:16 [Zakim]
- -DanielColoma
- 15:19:18 [Zakim]
- -JereK
- 15:19:18 [paddy]
- paddy has left #dap
- 15:19:20 [Zakim]
- -wonsuk
- 15:19:22 [Zakim]
- -??P1
- 15:19:45 [fhirsch]
- RRSAgent, generate minutes
- 15:19:45 [RRSAgent]
- I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2009/10/07-dap-minutes.html fhirsch
- 15:19:47 [cuihtlauac]
- cuihtlauac has left #dap
- 15:20:17 [darobin]
- fhirsch: thanks!
- 15:20:26 [darobin]
- AnssiK: you did great, thanks a lot
- 15:20:51 [Zakim]
- -AnssiK
- 15:24:56 [Zakim]
- - +29605aabb
- 15:28:38 [darobin]
- Zakim, who's there?
- 15:28:38 [Zakim]
- I don't understand your question, darobin.
- 15:28:42 [darobin]
- Zakim, who's here?
- 15:28:42 [Zakim]
- On the phone I see Kangchan, paddy
- 15:28:43 [Zakim]
- On IRC I see DanielColoma, hendry, Claes, JereK, Laura_Arribas, wonsuk, AnssiK, Zakim, RRSAgent, fhirsch, darobin, tlr, maxf, arg, ilkka, trackbot, dom
- 15:28:54 [darobin]
- heh, funny how some people just stay
- 15:29:00 [darobin]
- Zakim, end call
- 15:29:00 [Zakim]
- I don't understand 'end call', darobin
- 15:29:11 [darobin]
- Zakim, drop kangchan
- 15:29:11 [Zakim]
- Kangchan is being disconnected
- 15:29:12 [Zakim]
- -Kangchan
- 15:29:14 [darobin]
- Zakim, drop paddy
- 15:29:14 [Zakim]
- paddy is being disconnected
- 15:29:15 [Zakim]
- UW_DAP()10:00AM has ended
- 15:29:16 [Zakim]
- Attendees were ilkka, fjh, darobin, Kangchan, wonsuk, AnssiK, DzungTran, JereK, marcin2, richt, +29605aabb, LauraArribas, niklasw, +46.1.08.01.aacc, Claes, Thomas, +1.604.685.aadd,
- 15:29:18 [Zakim]
- ... paddy, DanielColoma, +1.604.685.aaff, Bryan_Sullivan
- 15:30:14 [hendry]
- hendry has left #dap
- 15:36:16 [JereK]
- JereK has left #dap
- 15:52:53 [AnssiK]
- AnssiK has left #dap
- 15:58:57 [darobin]
- okay, transition request made for the requirements document
- 17:03:59 [wonsuk]
- wonsuk has left #dap
- 17:32:49 [Zakim]
- Zakim has left #dap