21:01:10 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #webapps
21:01:10 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2009/07/22-webapps-irc
21:01:12 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs public
21:01:12 <Zakim> Zakim has joined #webapps
21:01:14 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be WAPP
21:01:14 <Zakim> I do not see a conference matching that name scheduled within the next hour, trackbot
21:01:15 <trackbot> Meeting: Web Applications Working Group Teleconference
21:01:15 <trackbot> Date: 22 July 2009
21:01:17 <shepazu> Zakim, call shepazu 
21:01:17 <Zakim> sorry, shepazu, I don't know what conference this is
21:01:29 <shepazu> zakim, this is DOM3
21:01:29 <Zakim> ok, shepazu; that matches IA_WebApps(DOM3)5:00PM
21:01:35 <shepazu> zakim, call shepazu 
21:01:35 <Zakim> ok, shepazu; the call is being made
21:01:36 <Zakim> +Shepazu
21:01:37 <Zakim> -??P1
21:01:56 <Zakim> +??P1
21:02:05 <smaug> Zakim, ??P1 is me
21:02:05 <Zakim> +smaug; got it
21:02:47 <shepazu> zakim, who's here?
21:02:47 <Zakim> On the phone I see [Microsoft], Shepazu, smaug
21:02:48 <Zakim> On IRC I see RRSAgent, MSjacob, shepazu, heycam, ilinsky, gsnedders, Marcos, krijnh, karl, tlr, Lachy, smaug, hendry, trackbot, Dashiva, gavin_, timelyx, Hixie, inimino, phenny
21:03:01 <shepazu> zakim, [Microsoft] is MSJacob 
21:03:01 <Zakim> +MSJacob; got it
21:05:38 <shepazu> Zakim, pick a victim
21:05:38 <Zakim> Not knowing who is chairing or who scribed recently, I propose smaug
21:05:51 <shepazu> chair: shepazu 
21:06:25 <shepazu> scribenick: smaug 
21:06:35 <shepazu> scribe: Olli Pettay
21:07:41 <smaug> shepazu: we are all awesome
21:08:10 <shepazu> Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-dom/2009JulSep/0039.html
21:09:08 <smaug> MSjacob: smaug: the new draft looks reasonable
21:10:28 <dand> dand has joined #webapps
21:10:43 <dand> howdy
21:10:54 <shepazu> http://dev.w3.org/2006/webapi/DOM-Level-3-Events/html/DOM3-Events.html
21:11:16 <shepazu> Zakim, code?
21:11:16 <Zakim> the conference code is 3663 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 tel:+33.4.89.06.34.99 tel:+44.117.370.6152), shepazu
21:11:22 <shepazu> there you go, dand 
21:12:13 <dand> cheers
21:12:30 <Zakim> +[IPcaller]
21:12:33 <smaug> shepazu: some of the events needs the be defined better, as per the comments sent to the mailing list
21:12:49 <shepazu> ZAKIM, [IPcaller] IS dand 
21:12:49 <Zakim> +dand; got it
21:13:51 <MikeSmith> MikeSmith has joined #webapps
21:14:32 <smaug> shepazu: I'll add some more diagrams, for example about mouse events handling
21:14:34 <dand> um, can't hear you all of a sudden
21:15:46 <Zakim> -dand
21:16:15 <Zakim> +[IPcaller]
21:16:18 <dand> yeah, just done
21:16:31 <shepazu> Zakim, [IPcaller] is dand 
21:16:31 <Zakim> +dand; got it
21:17:36 <smaug> smaug: I haven't commented about mouseenter/leave
21:17:45 <smaug> shepazu: they just went in
21:18:19 <smaug> shepazu: need to sort out when mouseenter/leave actually happen
21:19:41 <smaug> shepazu: DOMFocusIn/Out are deprecated
21:20:17 <shepazu> http://www.quirksmode.org/dom/events/index.html
21:22:10 <smaug> shepazu: MSjacob to test DOMFocusIn/out vs focus/blur
21:22:47 <shepazu> Action: MSjacob to test DOMFocusIn/out vs focus/blur
21:22:47 <trackbot> Sorry, couldn't find user - MSjacob
21:22:49 <shepazu> Action: Travis to test DOMFocusIn/out vs focus/blur
21:22:49 <trackbot> Created ACTION-386 - Test DOMFocusIn/out vs focus/blur [on Travis Leithead - due 2009-07-29].
21:23:23 <smaug> MSjacob: there is no such thing like beforeblur/beforefocus. Should there be such thing?
21:25:20 <smaug> IE has focusin which happens before focus changes
21:27:07 <smaug> MSjacob: though, IE hasn't capture phase atm
21:28:34 <smaug> ISSUE: resolve case of focusin in IE
21:28:34 <trackbot> Created ISSUE-92 - Resolve case of focusin in IE ; please complete additional details at http://www.w3.org/2008/webapps/track/issues/92/edit .
21:29:34 <smaug> Zakim, who is talking
21:29:34 <Zakim> I don't understand 'who is talking', smaug
21:30:32 <smaug> MSjacob: there is need for relatedTarget to know where the focus is moving from
21:35:14 <smaug> ACTION: shepazu to add relatedTarget to UIEvent or to some new interface (for focus handling events)
21:35:14 <trackbot> Created ACTION-387 - Add relatedTarget to UIEvent or to some new interface (for focus handling events) [on Doug Schepers - due 2009-07-29].
21:36:12 <smaug> ACTION: smaug to test focus handling in gecko
21:36:13 <trackbot> Created ACTION-388 - Test focus handling in gecko [on Olli Pettay - due 2009-07-29].
21:36:47 <smaug> Topic: DOMActivate vs. Click
21:38:56 <smaug> shepazu: it seems to me that only firefox has implemented DOMActivate
21:39:40 <smaug> shepazu: where else is DOMActivate used
21:40:39 <smaug> http://www.w3.org/TR/2007/REC-xforms-20071029/#evt-activate
21:40:58 <smaug> shepazu: svg might mention DOMActivate too
21:41:43 <smaug> shepazu: what implementations use it and who relies on it and what are the use cases
21:42:02 <smaug> shepazu: what content relies upon it
21:43:21 <smaug> shepazu: I'm also concerned about a11y
21:44:47 <smaug> shepazu: I'd like to invite comments about DOMActivate
21:45:27 <smaug> shepazu: click is also pretty abstract
21:46:02 <smaug> shepazu: I'll contact the WAI folks
21:48:18 <chaals> chaals has joined #webapps
21:49:45 <smaug> yes
21:50:16 <chaals> zakim, code?
21:50:16 <Zakim> the conference code is 3663 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 tel:+33.4.89.06.34.99 tel:+44.117.370.6152), chaals
21:50:33 <smaug> Topic: composition events
21:51:03 <Zakim> +??P3
21:51:09 <chaals> zakim, ??p3 is me
21:51:09 <Zakim> +chaals; got it
21:51:13 <shepazu> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-dom/2009JulSep/att-0010/compositionevent.txt
21:52:23 <smaug> chaals: I agree, DOMFocusIn/Out/Activate could be deprecated
21:55:31 <MSJacob> MSJacob has joined #webapps
21:55:43 <MSJacob> Dan's composition events mail: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-dom/2009JulSep/0010.html
21:57:27 <smaug> shepazu: I didn't know whether to add/use composition event or text events
21:59:15 <smaug> do we need the cursor position data?
22:02:16 <smaug> shepazu: maybe a property .compositionTarget to the event?
22:05:43 <smaug> shepazu: what kind of range could we add to the event?
22:11:45 <smaug> dand: can say that composionstart is fired before composion really starts
22:12:34 <smaug> dand: so that cursor/focus can be moved to another place 
22:16:28 <smaug> shepazu: for now we develop this in D3E, but if it gets really complicated, may need to move elsewhere
22:17:14 <anne2> anne2 has joined #webapps
22:17:34 <shepazu> Action: Dand to write up  details of compositions selection and sequence
22:17:34 <trackbot> Sorry, couldn't find user - Dand
22:18:09 <dand> http://www.danilatos.com/event-test/ime-test.html
22:24:41 <smaug> shepazu: should this be like defined now, or should a property be added to text event?
22:25:28 <Zakim> -chaals
22:26:18 <smaug> shepazu: I've been thinking to add a new property to textEvent "origin"
22:26:34 <smaug> shepazu: whether the text is from copy-paste/dnd/etc..
22:26:42 <smaug> shepazu: would it be useful?
22:26:56 <smaug> dand: yes, sounds useful
22:28:46 <smaug> we need a list of most common possible values for the "origin"
22:31:35 <anne2> (and another name, origin is too confusing with the scheme/hostname/port tuple used for security purposes)
22:31:56 <shepazu> agreed, anne2 
22:32:59 <shepazu> unknown, paste, IME, voice, handwriting, multimodal?
22:42:31 <smaug> smaug: I'll test key+click event handling
22:44:35 <Zakim> -MSJacob
22:44:40 <Zakim> -smaug
22:44:43 <shepazu> trackbot, stop telcon
22:44:43 <trackbot> Sorry, shepazu, I don't understand 'trackbot, stop telcon'. Please refer to http://www.w3.org/2005/06/tracker/irc for help
22:44:45 <Zakim> -Shepazu
22:44:50 <shepazu> trackbot, end telcon
22:44:50 <trackbot> Zakim, list attendees
22:44:50 <Zakim> As of this point the attendees have been Shepazu, smaug, MSJacob, dand, chaals
22:44:51 <trackbot> RRSAgent, please draft minutes
22:44:51 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2009/07/22-webapps-minutes.html trackbot
22:44:52 <trackbot> RRSAgent, bye
22:44:52 <RRSAgent> I see 5 open action items saved in http://www.w3.org/2009/07/22-webapps-actions.rdf :
22:44:52 <RRSAgent> ACTION: MSjacob to test DOMFocusIn/out vs focus/blur [1]
22:44:52 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/07/22-webapps-irc#T21-22-47
22:44:52 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Travis to test DOMFocusIn/out vs focus/blur [2]
22:44:52 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/07/22-webapps-irc#T21-22-49
22:44:52 <RRSAgent> ACTION: shepazu to add relatedTarget to UIEvent or to some new interface (for focus handling events) [3]
22:44:52 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/07/22-webapps-irc#T21-35-14
22:44:52 <RRSAgent> ACTION: smaug to test focus handling in gecko [4]
22:44:52 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/07/22-webapps-irc#T21-36-12
22:44:52 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Dand to write up  details of compositions selection and sequence [5]
22:44:52 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/07/22-webapps-irc#T22-17-34
22:44:54 <Zakim> -dand
22:44:56 <Zakim> IA_WebApps(DOM3)5:00PM has ended
22:44:57 <Zakim> Attendees were Shepazu, smaug, MSJacob, dand, chaals